Why are more men inclined to dive?

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almitywife:
1st shop gets the divers in and and stay

2nd shop gets the divers in and within months they leave and usually end up at the shop #1

so although shop 2 is far more attractive on the surface they lack in many other ways (i do notice the older guys tend to stay there for longer... maybe old guy-pretty gal/shop syndrome)

I agree that you must have substance to sustain that business. Our nicer shops owner was an employee of the other shop for close to a decade so he knows his business. He took what he learned & expanded to make it more female friendly.
 
crazyTomato:
The few women who did scuba dive, I have to command them.

Sorry...while I had my annoying spelling bee hat on I had to point out this freudian slip. It was too good to pass up given the whole MSP discussion. I promise I'll stop now.

Mel
 
crazyTomato:
Anyway, bottom line, men are not more driven. It’s all cultural. I really hate that line….men being more adventurous and so on. It just makes me want to scream!

i agree... the biological differences are small and can be overcome (obviously, look at the number of women divers on this board)

the real differences are cultural and how men and women are socialized with different "goals" and "expectations" (basically, women are expected to look good and be caretakers; men are expected to be aggressive and show no emotions)

diving is just the type of thing men are raised to do and women really aren't ... or at least until very recently

but more and more i see those barriers breaking down, which is a good thing
 
Actually, CrazyTomato, I have to say that it may not be simply a matter of cultural conditioning. There may actually be a genetic component to these behavioral differences as well. Not saying this is good, or bad. However, there are gender-linked differences that we can't deny (even though a lot of what may be viewed that way are, as you say, culturally-induced rather than genetic).

And, guys, just what is so damned "adventurous" about planting our fat asses on the couch with beer and chips to watch football every Sunday, Monday, Thursday? Well, except when the Bears play, that's acceptable! I know a number of women who have a far greater sense of adventure than most of the men I know.

One such woman was a member of one of the all-woman expeditions to reach the South Pole. She was preparing to be a member of the first such team to cross Antarctica when their funding was pulled. Man, she has far more cajones (or tolerance to cold) than I'll ever have.
 
LOL!!!!!!! Freudian slip indeed!!! Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar!!!!! But I'll leave my mistake alone. Or I could fix it, but nah. Good catch by the way!



MelC:
Sorry...while I had my annoying spelling bee hat on I had to point out this freudian slip. It was too good to pass up given the whole MSP discussion. I promise I'll stop now.

Mel
 
drbill:
Actually, CrazyTomato, I have to say that it may not be simply a matter of cultural conditioning. There may actually be a gemnetic component to these behavioral differences as well. Not saying this is good, or bad. However, there are gender-linked differences that we can't deny (even though a lot of what may be viewed that way are, as you say, culturally-induced rather than genetic).

And, guys, just what is so damned "adventurous" about planting our fat asses on the couch with beer and chips to watch football every Sunday, Monday, Thursday? I know a number of women who have a far greater sense of adventure than most of the men I know.

Please don't say that. I honestly do think that having a "genetic component" to our behavioral difference excuses our culture of any deeper thoughts on this subject of why either gender does what they do. Sure there are physiological differences, but in the end, what really sums us up? It's our background, our beliefs, philosophies, the culture we live in, the society at large, the world, the politics, and so on. That's what drives us more than anything else. Not what we're "wired" to do. I seriously hate that line of thinking the most.
 
crazyTomato:
No, I wouldn’t say that the drive is deeper in men vs. women. I’d say look at the socialization process of what is considered acceptable for either gender. When you cite men as explorers, that’s not an accurate statement at all. Women were simply not allowed to step beyond the doors the way men were allowed to. If we think it’s difficult for women to scuba dive, can you imagine how it must have been like to explore back then ?????????

As for your poll, technically you'd be correct on how it would come out in terms of men saying they'd want to go west vs. women. But that's not a really fair statement to make. Look at the time period you chose. 1800??? It wasn't considered acceptable for women to want beyond marriage, kids, being a housewife and so on. For a woman to confess that she wanted to explore, she'd definitely be considered an odd bird out. Even if she wanted to explore, would she have been able to do so without a significant level of shunning and marginalization from the society? They did not welcome women who traveled alone. They would have called her quite a few names and thought that something was wrong with her. Even if she was brave enough to do it on her own, where would she have been able to earn an income to allow her to move alone? Women did not have their own money at all.

As for men not being supportive on subjects that their SO does……well…, maybe it’s because the way you’re raised to not think beyond yourself? I find that pretty common in men but not in women. Doesn’t mean that women are more altruistic. It just shows that men are allowed to get away with men being men, whereas with women, they’re socialized to think beyond themselves. Kind of depressing if you think about it, at least for me. I’d want my SO to be supportive and actually care about my activities, and not just vice versa. But, when you say men are not “capable”, that’s not true at all. They are capable. It’s just how you were raised to view your relationships and the world at large.

As for your last statement, ha…….that is the biggest garbage load I’ve heard of ever. You really don’t give women that much credit, do ya? All this energy and exploration, that’s where the line gets drawn at????? God. That’s just depressing the way you think. Look at TSandM…..she has that drive, the willingness…..but then again, she has a tremendous amount of self confidence to be able to do it, the money to do it, and the time to do it. Women do want to do it. They just have a lot of emotional barriers to overcome their socialization of how they’re viewed in doing certain activities. I couldn’t imagine doing this way back. The few women who did scuba dive, I have to command them. It took a lot of courage for them to do it.

Anyway, bottom line, men are not more driven. It’s all cultural. I really hate that line….men being more adventurous and so on. It just makes me want to scream!

Too much to site here.

If you read my offering carefully, it is mostly asking questions...not making statements. Your last paragraph makes far more of a judgement than anything I said.

I am sure women do not have the market cornered on "emotional barriers". I know a lot of men who fear the thought of diving. Hell, I hate grasshoppers! Everyone has their own baggage. The orginal topic is still "Why do more men dive than women". Cultural, most likely, genetic, who knows but the discussion should not throttled by differences of opinion.

I recognize your right to disagree with me or anyone else; not sure you should get so personal, but neither will "make me what to scream" or call your statements "garbage" when you post it.

Any of you other ladies interpret my post as crazytomato did?
 
My 2 cents....

I don't buy this wetsuit argument at all. If a woman looks good, it does not matter what she is wearing. A hot woman wearing a paper bag is still hot. I have never heard a guy say 'wow I thought she was hot until I saw her in a wetsuit'. Maybe the ladies think they do not look as good, but in my experience no guys think that.

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I think there is something to be said about cultural conditioning, but I think the force of attraction is stronger than that.

--Matt
 
are you saying that men are basically horn dogs?
 
TSandM:
Diving IS hard physical work, and involves discomfort, but I keep my horse in a barn where the almost purely female clientele rides and jumps, grooming horses and cleaning and hauling tack, which is not as hard as hauling dive gear, but is certainly physical labor. And that's a sport that's all female.

At the risk of getting smoked for off topic posts, I think horse activities show the same gender split but in a different fashion. My daughter showed Western, dressage, and started into jumping. Her age group male friends were rodeoing. They (the boys) had very little interest in the show aspects of horsemanship.

I think this has parallels in diving. The men are somewhat more drawn to the more exciting aspects of diving.

And it was my daughter who go me into diving. I think she had ulterior motives. Like, who would pay for the dive trips.... <sigh>

Art
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/peregrine/

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