Scubanarc, thanks for the information. Honestly I don't understand all the trash talk about banded wings. They can't support their claims of "bungeed wings of death" when questioned, It's getting old not to mention stupid.
Which do you think is better and why?
- Thread starter akforsyth
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Claypool was the student. Elkins was an instructor who tried to help in the rescue attempt and died as well.
The O2 hit theory for Ornstein only comes from McNulty. This is to minimize his lack of response to save an overweighted student that did not have the proper equipment (ie. steel stages, bondage wings) lack of experience and no real instructor to mentor her. The Outside story is grossly incomplete and inaccurate.
omar
The O2 hit theory for Ornstein only comes from McNulty. This is to minimize his lack of response to save an overweighted student that did not have the proper equipment (ie. steel stages, bondage wings) lack of experience and no real instructor to mentor her. The Outside story is grossly incomplete and inaccurate.
omar
PUG you are so diplomatic and non opinionated these days.
of course you are right the question did not mention wings at all, so you left that hot topic alone.
I see there is strong OMS talk this time, i think that is why it is good to rehash stuff as opposed to just looking at old threads.
as for the question at hand, I totaly agree with PUG. back plate and hraness are nothing realy special. other than the material it is made out of, and the oppinion of a continous hrness or not.
personaly I made my own backplate out of SS about ten years ago, and I do not use a continuos harness, simply because i never thought of it when i built mine and there was not a lot of information about them then. it has served me well so i have not replaced it...if i were to do it over again i would probably go with a single peice of webbing. but i am not really concerned about anything breaking and causing me great grief.
now to stray off the topic....I use two types of wings.
I love my OMS dbl bladder bunged wings for open ocean, deep , and wreck diving. why....cause the air doesn't shift, the wing stays in tight to your body, the air is well distributed evenly. [which doesn't work for DIR cause their stage bottles are all on one side] dbl bladder for redundence, a dry suit is foolish at depth, and swiming up from 400 feet is not going to happen. anybody who is properly weighted at 20 feet with emptly tanks will be very heavy at 300-400 so i want the back up.
a bag is out of the question at depth well at least not as good an option as your reserve bladder.
I use a dive Rite wing with Abs backplate for cave diving simple to be simplistic, and use my drysuit as back up.....which i would never do in the open ocean. I use the abs backplate to get some of the weight off of me
of course you are right the question did not mention wings at all, so you left that hot topic alone.
I see there is strong OMS talk this time, i think that is why it is good to rehash stuff as opposed to just looking at old threads.
as for the question at hand, I totaly agree with PUG. back plate and hraness are nothing realy special. other than the material it is made out of, and the oppinion of a continous hrness or not.
personaly I made my own backplate out of SS about ten years ago, and I do not use a continuos harness, simply because i never thought of it when i built mine and there was not a lot of information about them then. it has served me well so i have not replaced it...if i were to do it over again i would probably go with a single peice of webbing. but i am not really concerned about anything breaking and causing me great grief.
now to stray off the topic....I use two types of wings.
I love my OMS dbl bladder bunged wings for open ocean, deep , and wreck diving. why....cause the air doesn't shift, the wing stays in tight to your body, the air is well distributed evenly. [which doesn't work for DIR cause their stage bottles are all on one side] dbl bladder for redundence, a dry suit is foolish at depth, and swiming up from 400 feet is not going to happen. anybody who is properly weighted at 20 feet with emptly tanks will be very heavy at 300-400 so i want the back up.
a bag is out of the question at depth well at least not as good an option as your reserve bladder.
I use a dive Rite wing with Abs backplate for cave diving simple to be simplistic, and use my drysuit as back up.....which i would never do in the open ocean. I use the abs backplate to get some of the weight off of me
(((John S. Claypool, 34 Experienced in sport, technical, and law enforcement
diving.
Instructor qualified to teach novice through advanced nitrox.
Mike J. Elkins, 36 Experienced in sport and technical diving, pursuing
further training
in order to improve his skills and capabilities.
Larry J. Roth, 42 Experienced in military, sport, and technical diving.
29 years experience.)))
Apparently we were both wrong in away. Elkins was not the instructor though. The whole bungie wing thing was another made up story by GI to suffice his huge inflated ego. This is just my opinion, all knowledge obtained was from Techdiver Mailing List.
All the info about bungie wings was made up from people who weren't even there and from people who never did any kind of investigation. Just people who are always shooting their mouths off about who is a stroke and who isnt. Same old story.
diving.
Instructor qualified to teach novice through advanced nitrox.
Mike J. Elkins, 36 Experienced in sport and technical diving, pursuing
further training
in order to improve his skills and capabilities.
Larry J. Roth, 42 Experienced in military, sport, and technical diving.
29 years experience.)))
Apparently we were both wrong in away. Elkins was not the instructor though. The whole bungie wing thing was another made up story by GI to suffice his huge inflated ego. This is just my opinion, all knowledge obtained was from Techdiver Mailing List.
All the info about bungie wings was made up from people who weren't even there and from people who never did any kind of investigation. Just people who are always shooting their mouths off about who is a stroke and who isnt. Same old story.
-BlueHole-
Guest
A stainless plate is a stainless plate, an aluminum plate is an aluminum plate. If you buy Halcyon, you support the hard working (barely above minimum wage) work force of High Springs, Florida. If you buy a Dive Rite, you support the work force of much larger Lake City Florida. High Springs is about 17 minutes from my house. Lake City is about 35 Minutes from my house.
Buy either one and help MY local economy. As for wings, I've got a few hundred dives on a Dive Rite wing and a few hundred on a Halcyon wing. I've got about a hundred dives on an OMS wing too. I like the inflator hose better on the Halcyon, but for the $200 cost difference, I can buy 5 inflator assemblies and make whatever I want. I have only had a few problems with any wing. The wing in question was the Halcyon, but in all fairness, I was diving in sand restrictions and had a problem with the power inflator button jamming. I fixed it both times. I also had the deflator jam coming out of Cow Springs. That's not a wing problem though, it's a sand issue.
In the end, it really doesn't matter what you buy as long as it will meet your requirements. OMS, Dive Rite, or Halcyon Most of the people who say that you should only dive Halcyon have very little technical experience and are going on what they are told, not what they have actual experience with.
I was a Halcyon dealer a couple of years ago. My wholesale prices were close to Dive Rite's retail prices. I bought in to the whole Halcyon gimmick too. People hype it up and build it into something that is unnecessary. It's only a wing or a plate, it will not make you superman!! I sold a few (mostly to myself), then dropped the dealership. Now, I teach through dealers of OMS and Dive Rite (separate shops).
Buy either one and help MY local economy. As for wings, I've got a few hundred dives on a Dive Rite wing and a few hundred on a Halcyon wing. I've got about a hundred dives on an OMS wing too. I like the inflator hose better on the Halcyon, but for the $200 cost difference, I can buy 5 inflator assemblies and make whatever I want. I have only had a few problems with any wing. The wing in question was the Halcyon, but in all fairness, I was diving in sand restrictions and had a problem with the power inflator button jamming. I fixed it both times. I also had the deflator jam coming out of Cow Springs. That's not a wing problem though, it's a sand issue.
In the end, it really doesn't matter what you buy as long as it will meet your requirements. OMS, Dive Rite, or Halcyon Most of the people who say that you should only dive Halcyon have very little technical experience and are going on what they are told, not what they have actual experience with.
I was a Halcyon dealer a couple of years ago. My wholesale prices were close to Dive Rite's retail prices. I bought in to the whole Halcyon gimmick too. People hype it up and build it into something that is unnecessary. It's only a wing or a plate, it will not make you superman!! I sold a few (mostly to myself), then dropped the dealership. Now, I teach through dealers of OMS and Dive Rite (separate shops).
leadweight
Contributor
Easy to don and doff.
Most comfortable.
Packs small & light.
Holds tank closest to your back.
Does not need a crotch strap with singles.
Very streamlined when used with Travel Wing.
Holds tank securely.
Main disadvantage: If you back your F-150 over it, it will probably break.
Most comfortable.
Packs small & light.
Holds tank closest to your back.
Does not need a crotch strap with singles.
Very streamlined when used with Travel Wing.
Holds tank securely.
Main disadvantage: If you back your F-150 over it, it will probably break.
DIR Tec Diver
Guest
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Hello,
I am not going to get sucked into another one of these battles over the best systems, but there is a reason why the worlds best divers choose Halcyon.
Get the best, your life depends on it...
I am not going to get sucked into another one of these battles over the best systems, but there is a reason why the worlds best divers choose Halcyon.
Get the best, your life depends on it...
I thought John Bennett used OMS stuff? He does hold the world's OC deep dive record, doesn't he??
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