What the ?#$@ is the deal with LeisurePro?
- Thread starter PB125
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pcornell
Contributor
I think this argument is laughable. I was just recently going through this "online" vs. "lds" question in my own mind as I began buying gear for my whole family. When I was last active recreationally, this wasn't a choice.
My wife and son went in and signed up for OW class - the shop gave us a $100 discount on the class for buying their personal gear at the shop. So we did. We ended up with some gear that they NEVER used (weight belts), and paid about $150 more each to buy the gear. IOW, we went negative $50/ea on that transaction alone.
I like the instructor at the shop, so I attempted to shop for the rest of the gear with them. They wouldn't even discuss being competitive on their pricing. I asked them to just get close; I was trying to be flexible. (I don't know why I felt I should be flexible when they weren't). I bought my stuff from LP. I had no trouble with the transaction, shipping or merchandise in any way. I have since bought several more items from them, all the same result.
I have also bought a lot of incidental items from my LDS; including classes and misc. rental items as well as overpriced snorkel gear - I've spent about $2,000 in the LDS too. I've also referred some people to the shop for some classes. Upon further review I probably shouldn't have because those people have tried to shop there and they have a take it or leave it gear pricing policy - and that is the way they present it.
The thing that really ticks me off is the store manager (not the instructor that I like) will start giving customers that song and dance about "where are you going to get fills?" and "where will you get training if we close because you buy your gear from LP?" He also claimed that he had a bunch of customers that have come in to the store with online merchandise asking to have it fixed. This is just a story he heard from someone and is repeating, this never actually happened to him and he has no personal knowledge or experience with this type of situation.After about the third time I heard this from him, I pressed him for details until he admitted he was just repeating something the owner told him. I believe these battle crys have been repeated among weak local LDS' in an effort to discredit the competition that is kicking their butt. they also use it to try to intimidate customers so they will be scared to order online. Just like the story about how LP gets their parts from dumpsters........And this shop does try to charge $15 for an air fill.
Also, I've gotten more incorrect information from my LDS in the last month than I would have ever imagined. Like the shop manager looked me straight in the eye and said "if you breath pure O2 at anything deeper than 19' you'll die". He actually believed that BS. Just scary.
So while I had a predispostion to do business locally, and I gave them some business and opportunities for more - they really have dropped the ball and are not competitive. They are not as cheap, don't have as good of selection, don't have as much expertise, act like they don't care, try to blame it on the customers, lie when they don't know the correct answer and in the end they have much less credibility than most online retailers that I have done business with. This LDS claims to be the biggest in my area. Unbelievable. Their business model is based on getting unknowing newbies in for class, selling them a bunch of over priced gear one time, and never seeing them again.
So in Catherine's words, they don't bring anything to the table. That is a value statement. Someone earlier said that price is the only thing that is important and value doesn't matter. What you bring to the table for the price I pay is the value. A transaction will only occur when the perception is that price and value intersect.
To the OP - sorry your thread turned in to this debate; my experience with LP has been exceptional, I'm sure they will fix your problems given the chance.
My wife and son went in and signed up for OW class - the shop gave us a $100 discount on the class for buying their personal gear at the shop. So we did. We ended up with some gear that they NEVER used (weight belts), and paid about $150 more each to buy the gear. IOW, we went negative $50/ea on that transaction alone.
I like the instructor at the shop, so I attempted to shop for the rest of the gear with them. They wouldn't even discuss being competitive on their pricing. I asked them to just get close; I was trying to be flexible. (I don't know why I felt I should be flexible when they weren't). I bought my stuff from LP. I had no trouble with the transaction, shipping or merchandise in any way. I have since bought several more items from them, all the same result.
I have also bought a lot of incidental items from my LDS; including classes and misc. rental items as well as overpriced snorkel gear - I've spent about $2,000 in the LDS too. I've also referred some people to the shop for some classes. Upon further review I probably shouldn't have because those people have tried to shop there and they have a take it or leave it gear pricing policy - and that is the way they present it.
The thing that really ticks me off is the store manager (not the instructor that I like) will start giving customers that song and dance about "where are you going to get fills?" and "where will you get training if we close because you buy your gear from LP?" He also claimed that he had a bunch of customers that have come in to the store with online merchandise asking to have it fixed. This is just a story he heard from someone and is repeating, this never actually happened to him and he has no personal knowledge or experience with this type of situation.After about the third time I heard this from him, I pressed him for details until he admitted he was just repeating something the owner told him. I believe these battle crys have been repeated among weak local LDS' in an effort to discredit the competition that is kicking their butt. they also use it to try to intimidate customers so they will be scared to order online. Just like the story about how LP gets their parts from dumpsters........And this shop does try to charge $15 for an air fill.
Also, I've gotten more incorrect information from my LDS in the last month than I would have ever imagined. Like the shop manager looked me straight in the eye and said "if you breath pure O2 at anything deeper than 19' you'll die". He actually believed that BS. Just scary.
So while I had a predispostion to do business locally, and I gave them some business and opportunities for more - they really have dropped the ball and are not competitive. They are not as cheap, don't have as good of selection, don't have as much expertise, act like they don't care, try to blame it on the customers, lie when they don't know the correct answer and in the end they have much less credibility than most online retailers that I have done business with. This LDS claims to be the biggest in my area. Unbelievable. Their business model is based on getting unknowing newbies in for class, selling them a bunch of over priced gear one time, and never seeing them again.
So in Catherine's words, they don't bring anything to the table. That is a value statement. Someone earlier said that price is the only thing that is important and value doesn't matter. What you bring to the table for the price I pay is the value. A transaction will only occur when the perception is that price and value intersect.
To the OP - sorry your thread turned in to this debate; my experience with LP has been exceptional, I'm sure they will fix your problems given the chance.
bluewatertoy
Contributor
CaptPaul:
Other than getting air fills, where does it state that I have to be certified to buy anything from your store. If I have the money and my own compressor at home, why would you or anyone else deny me the purchase of scuba equipment. It just doesn't make sense. You are not the general publics mother.
Kelly
jpsexton
Contributor
pcornell:
This is why I always get in the middle of these discussions. That seems to be the business model that keeps these shops open and probably will continue to keep them open. As PT Barnum once said "theres a sucker born every minuet"! IMO it's also the business model that gives the whole hobby a black eye. :shiner1:
pcornell
Contributor
jpsexton:
Agreed.
EastEndDiver
Contributor
How does someone ( not certified) buy a gift for someone ( certified) if you require C-Cards?
CaptPaul:
Don't know about Aqualung supplying LP,my sale rep at this time says no,but Dacor used to deliver directly to LP back door .We taught Dacor office people from Connecticut office and their people from finance told us of LP bill that was owed to them.We dropped Dacor as a line ,for that reason and others..Other LDS in the area did the same.
DiveMaven
Contributor
I've done all my certification classes on Maui. I've purchased gear locally (not Maui) and on the internet, and have NEVER been asked for a C-card. The stores don't care if I'm certified or not, they're just selling me stuff, not taking me diving.
On the other hand, I've never been on a charter, liveaboard, or rented a tank without being asked for my c-card. Nor have I been allowed to take a nitrox class, AOW, or Rescue without a c-card. THAT'S where the liability comes in, not at the point of sale for gear.
On the other hand, I've never been on a charter, liveaboard, or rented a tank without being asked for my c-card. Nor have I been allowed to take a nitrox class, AOW, or Rescue without a c-card. THAT'S where the liability comes in, not at the point of sale for gear.
mike_s
Contributor
catherine96821:
Most stores used to do it long ago. It was there way of trying to con you into taking a training class. But I've never had one check me for a purchase of gear.
I've had a few random shops check me while I was on vacation for a c-card for an air fill.
I'd say only about 20% to 30% of the time I'm asked for a C-card when booking a dive boat seat on a charter. Maybe less than that. But if a person shows up and need to rent gear and tanks, then I'd say they get checked a lot more.
Capt Paul asked about getting on a Liveboard without being checked for a C-card. I've done that without being checked.
As for checking card for gear sales, any LDS that doesn't sell something because of a C-card is just their choice. But the customer is just going to go to another shop that will or just go online and click "add to cart" and buy it there.
If Capt Paul wants to check them, I have no problem with that.
this is a crazy industry isn't it?
fire_diver
Contributor
CaptPaul:
No, you're being a troll. You are intentionally trying to stir the pot and get an argument going.
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