Value of the DIR approach

[HowardE]

Let me re-phrase....In a perfect world all divers would be practicing the same system.I don't know about you, but after I was diving awhile I noticed a lot of hack divers out there. I don't care what you practice, DIR, HOG, whatever. We just need to churn out better divers period. I'm not saying I was anything special when I started out. I'm talking about stupid stuff like divers heading out without even knowing how their computers work. Or having enough knowledge to get through a dive without it if they had to. Or not diving 10 pounds overweighted all the time. Common sense stuff.

Common sense is something that doesn't exist (if it did, it would truly be shared by ALL). Why should everyone dive the same rig? That's a ludicrous notion. We should all wear the same clothes, and be the same, because it's easier too?? I've seen and dived with many divers whom many on this board would throw a hissy if they saw them. No skills.. no buoyancy, no nothing... but they loved their dives, and they survived. My statement is, "Not every situation calls for militant training and practice" - yup. I stopped "training" after I completed my AOW course 200 + some odd dives ago. Can I frog kick, or backwards kick, in my split fins? Yup. Can I self rescue - Yup. I'm not a "15 dives a year" average diver either. I have well over 100 dives in this year alone. Actually, I have closer to 200 dives this year. The point is... Not everyone dives in no viz, overhead, cold, etc. More people don't dive in those environments at all (or ever) than do. The VALUE of DIR is not wasted on the person who only dives in the ocean, in non-overhead, warm, 50+ viz environments, but it most certainly is overkill and a lot more training than an average person would need. Could DIR be getting a bad rap from some of the over exuberant blinded by the kool-aid people on SB? Possibly.

There are those who feel that training constantly for something that may or may not happen is wise. There are those of us who feel confident in our skills, and don't have to run drills on every dive, and spend 1/2 of our time honing our skills and practicing and training over and over again.

Like I said, different situations call for different measures. If I was a professional rescue diver, I would probably spend a lot of time training, and tying knots for practice. If I was a cave diver, I'd probably practice running line, and drill my skills... but I'm not.

I am certainly tired of the over exuberant DIR "everyone should be doing this - this way" attitude of SOME PEOPLE (not all) whom just want to push their beliefs on everyone else.

(I hope nobody takes these words as angry - I'm not at all - and I have dived with and enjoy diving with several GUE trained divers)

@RonFrank - notice my profile pic... I have a BP/W as well

 

[joe rock]

I have dived with tech certified divers who were awful.

I think every agency and most instructors believe and teach that good buoyancy control is important, and that good buddy skills are desirable. I know from my personal experience that not all instructors pay any attention to those ideas, either in the classes they teach or in their own diving. GUE is different in that regard. What is mouthed is demonstrated, and the out-of-class dives I've done with DIR instructors have included meticulous attention to pre-dive planning, pre-dive equipment checking, underwater communication and situational awareness, and a post-dive debrief with dispassionate honesty. Whether you dive a BP/W or not isn't the important thing. Whether you plan well, execute the dive you've planned competently, and spend some thoughtful time reflecting on the dive and how you could make it a more thoroughly delightful experience for all participants next time -- That's what's important.

Lynn, for the sake of argument, let's concede the point that there are good and bad instructors. Since agencies like PADI and NAUI are large they have the most potential to have some loser instructors. Let me pose this for consideration. Is the good bouyancy control (insert any skill here) dependent on the instructor or the student? If taught proper skills, regardless of methodology is it not incumbent on the student to practice those skills to become proficient?

I'll float the hypothesis that the very nature of the personalities that lean toward DIR are also comitted to practice. The same can't be said for all those seeking diving certification. For proof I submit the numerous posts you make (which I enjoy) that detail the trials and tribulations of the skills you practiced on that particular dive. I'll bet if someone showed you those skills you'd practice them if you never found DIR.

I love to wreck dive off the New Jersey coast. Personally, I didn't feel comfortable diving deeper, non-intact wrecks until my reel skills and ability to shoot a line were more than adequate. So, I went to the local quarry weekly and practiced. I was amazed at how many people on the boat had terrible skills running a line. Than back on the boat, someone was joking how lost he and his buddy were on the wreck. Was that because of 1) Bad instruction 2) No instruction 3) Good instruction with failure to practice skill set. (rehtorical question, I have no clue )

JR

 

[Ben_ca]

Was that because of :

1. Bad instruction
2. No instruction
3. Good instruction with failure to practice skill set. (rehtorical question, I have no clue )

JR

So let's keep opening the can of worms So should scuba diving be a :

1. certification (one time, no expiration)
2. qualification (must be renewed periodically)

I wish diving certs/quals were like FAA flying requirements....you have to have # number of dives every so many days...

Most reasonable people will practice their skills or seek out professional help if they haven't been in the water but then again not all do. I like the practice sessions and the attention to detail when it comes to skills. The checklist discipline is also a nice thing. I will brief up my pre dive brief off my wetnotes.... easy to do when you have pockets.

 

[Hank49]

So, TSandM, I'm giving you the same answer to this question I gave the other day -- IT ALL DEPENDS ON YOUR DEFINITION OF A RECREATIONAL DIVER!!!

So Peter.... what did you get for dinner last night after this one?....tuna fish?....cheerios?....

 

[RV]

Oh... I think you meant, "Resistance is futile." (if we are sticking with the Borg theme.)

BTW, in case you are curious as to the secrets of a DIR class, here is a pic of one of the rituals:

don't forget the "borg juice" they shoot you up with to make your skin turn grey

 

[RV]

I dohn't have the energy or inclination at the moment to write the entire thesis. So let's start with something every diver should be able to do that is not part of the GUE curriculum.

I feel that every diver should be able, whilst underwater, in black mask, wearing three finger mitts, to tie a one-handed bowline, coming and going, with the left hand and then the right hand. While we're on knots, under the same circumstaces every diver should be able to join two lines of dissimilar diameter with a becket (sheet bend) and a twist, tie a clove hitch and tie an anchor bend.

everyone here can do that... can't they?

 

[RV]

Not sure if this is the right way to do a link, but here's what I got.

http://www.animatedknots.com/knotlist.php?LogoImage=LogoGrog.jpg&Website=http

excellent!!!

 

[SparticleBrane]

There's an objective to every dive whether it's capturing pictures of pretty pink fishies or cruising through the decks of the Thistlegorm.

I quickly skimmed through that video and wow :shakehead. Someone wants $50 for that? You couldn't pay me to take that video off someone's hands...those divers were awful.

 

[HowardE]

What makes them awful? That they're not doing it right? They had a successful dive no?

Was it the split fins, with the flutter kicks - inside the wreck :11: It's a miracle they survived.

 

[dlndavid]

Because skiiing is for dweebs. Rule #1 is "if you weren't born cool, at least try to look cool." All the cool daddies snowboard, sweetie

agree on the born cool part , but two long skinny sticks beat out one short fat stick any day, sit up straight in that chair sonny, put your hat on right and for God's sake, pull up your pants.

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a.) Newer divers with deficiencies in training and/or experience. If they can learn nothing more than basic buoyancy control and buddy awareness, then that's probably a huge win in itself. Most DIR trained divers that I've dove with have these skills down pretty well, or are working toward them.​

I knew I was deficient when you passed off Moonie to me, quit rubbing it in and give me a break, I was a noobie DS diver.
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