Trip Report: Raja Ampat Dive Resort
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Bali Diver
Contributor
@SMY Ondina yes understood and thats what i mean also in scheduled way and not on about the north as we know Biak etc.. but south west of the bay.The marine park which involves the local communties and whale shark projects and because of the whale sharks now LOB'S are being scheduled WHY ! Because there is good money to be made by doing these trips at say $400/$500 a person per day.This project and protection of the whale sharks involves the locals and the fisherman in a way created this magic with the whalesharks.
This should be respected and LOB'S should contribute a lot more out of their big profits and make a real differents,if i take $100 off you.is it fair i give you $10 in return for example.
That thought has to go into the fact that interaction with the whale sharks has to be done in a responsible controlled manner ,with rules Will in time the introduction of more and more Liveaboards as now what is starting in the area and its inpact on the whalesharks,with large diver groups.multiple dives,flashes going off all over the place,touching,chasing have a effect on them and then the pursuit to find them,it is not hard to look into the future and see this could well happen and then when the Lob's then leave the area.What then for the locals.
Look at the perfect example of Michael Aw and national geographic last year,total disgrace
Then there is Ahe Island who i keep mentioning and rightly so as a lot of hard work has and is being done there involving the local community and conservation of the area and protection of the reefs and whale shark project and making it possible for divers to come and enjoy diving and diving with the whalesharks and all profit generated flowing back into the various commiunities and by divers going there they are really helping to make a huge differents to the local communities and conservation of the area
What will happen to Ahe Island and the communities it is supporting if the whalesharks are chased away by the mass of LOB'S,
This part of Papua is a very,very poor area and a lot of hard work has,is being done in this area and if outsiders are now coming in then it is only fair that they care,help and give a good share of what they are coming into and taking away $$$ $$$ surely that is only fair or show me a LOB'S finance balance sheet from a trip and i could show what i think is fair
or go to Ahe Island and support the local community and projects 100 %
SMY Ondina some of my thoughts you asked,hope that helps.Is Photog involved with SMY Ondina also.
This should be respected and LOB'S should contribute a lot more out of their big profits and make a real differents,if i take $100 off you.is it fair i give you $10 in return for example.
That thought has to go into the fact that interaction with the whale sharks has to be done in a responsible controlled manner ,with rules Will in time the introduction of more and more Liveaboards as now what is starting in the area and its inpact on the whalesharks,with large diver groups.multiple dives,flashes going off all over the place,touching,chasing have a effect on them and then the pursuit to find them,it is not hard to look into the future and see this could well happen and then when the Lob's then leave the area.What then for the locals.
Look at the perfect example of Michael Aw and national geographic last year,total disgrace
Then there is Ahe Island who i keep mentioning and rightly so as a lot of hard work has and is being done there involving the local community and conservation of the area and protection of the reefs and whale shark project and making it possible for divers to come and enjoy diving and diving with the whalesharks and all profit generated flowing back into the various commiunities and by divers going there they are really helping to make a huge differents to the local communities and conservation of the area
What will happen to Ahe Island and the communities it is supporting if the whalesharks are chased away by the mass of LOB'S,
This part of Papua is a very,very poor area and a lot of hard work has,is being done in this area and if outsiders are now coming in then it is only fair that they care,help and give a good share of what they are coming into and taking away $$$ $$$ surely that is only fair or show me a LOB'S finance balance sheet from a trip and i could show what i think is fair
or go to Ahe Island and support the local community and projects 100 %SMY Ondina some of my thoughts you asked,hope that helps.Is Photog involved with SMY Ondina also.
TWIME, I've spent about one year total on Ondina since 2004 and chartered her many times. I found Paul's report to be way out there...
Paul contacted me and others privately by email (not PM) so I checked up on everything. I did not know Paul, was not involved with his trip in any way.
I know some divers who are on the ship now (today) and am helping a group plan a trip for March. So I was very concerned to understand what is happening. In corresponding with Paul and others I discovered some things in Paul's post true, some false, some "personal taste" that were not agreed with by others on the same trip. So I'm satisfied.
I have been writing Paul privately and I think he is OK with it now. There were problems, most of which were due to bad weather at the beginning of the trip. He complained to his agent, didn't get a quick enough response from the owners so he was frustrated and overreacted. He only joined scubaboard to post about this trip so I doubt he is interested to follow up. This is only my opinion based on correspondence I've had with everyone involved.
I've found the Ondina to be very protective of the reefs. In the years I've spent in the area (since 1999) I've seen many ships and resorts also, doing damage, but never Ondina. I, and others on the trips at the same time, have reported other ships to their owners when we saw their crew dragging anchor over Melysa's Garden, tied up to the finger island at Jamar Boo, breaking a chunk off the big (Nudibranch) island at Fiabacet and running their keel into the small island there. I have a video of it as our tender drivers were trying to get the attention of the ship's crew.
There are rules for Liveaboards in Raja Ampat. I know the owners of Ondina, along with several others who have been operating in the area for a long time, helped to write them. Ondina obeys them. Many of the new ships do not. I am always complaining about other ships doing things like I mentioned above.
I know Ondina hires mostly Indonesian crew, with the exception of a Western cruise director and normally one guide that are needed to handle their guests. Quite a few of their current crew are from the Sorong/Raja Ampat area. In years past they hired from the area and trained new hires to work with tourists. Many of those people are now working on other liveaboards including captains, first mates, chefs to deck hands. Ondina has employed several local Raja Ampat dive guides over the years when they are available, there are not many of them. Recently they are thinking to take on and train divemasters from the area. I would have to let the owners (especially the one that is on the ship right now) speak about that.
I've been working to get to Ahe. It is like pulling teeth to get prices, conditions any details at all. Do you have any reliable contact with a decision maker there?
Paul contacted me and others privately by email (not PM) so I checked up on everything. I did not know Paul, was not involved with his trip in any way.
I know some divers who are on the ship now (today) and am helping a group plan a trip for March. So I was very concerned to understand what is happening. In corresponding with Paul and others I discovered some things in Paul's post true, some false, some "personal taste" that were not agreed with by others on the same trip. So I'm satisfied.
I have been writing Paul privately and I think he is OK with it now. There were problems, most of which were due to bad weather at the beginning of the trip. He complained to his agent, didn't get a quick enough response from the owners so he was frustrated and overreacted. He only joined scubaboard to post about this trip so I doubt he is interested to follow up. This is only my opinion based on correspondence I've had with everyone involved.
I've found the Ondina to be very protective of the reefs. In the years I've spent in the area (since 1999) I've seen many ships and resorts also, doing damage, but never Ondina. I, and others on the trips at the same time, have reported other ships to their owners when we saw their crew dragging anchor over Melysa's Garden, tied up to the finger island at Jamar Boo, breaking a chunk off the big (Nudibranch) island at Fiabacet and running their keel into the small island there. I have a video of it as our tender drivers were trying to get the attention of the ship's crew.
There are rules for Liveaboards in Raja Ampat. I know the owners of Ondina, along with several others who have been operating in the area for a long time, helped to write them. Ondina obeys them. Many of the new ships do not. I am always complaining about other ships doing things like I mentioned above.
I know Ondina hires mostly Indonesian crew, with the exception of a Western cruise director and normally one guide that are needed to handle their guests. Quite a few of their current crew are from the Sorong/Raja Ampat area. In years past they hired from the area and trained new hires to work with tourists. Many of those people are now working on other liveaboards including captains, first mates, chefs to deck hands. Ondina has employed several local Raja Ampat dive guides over the years when they are available, there are not many of them. Recently they are thinking to take on and train divemasters from the area. I would have to let the owners (especially the one that is on the ship right now) speak about that.
I've been working to get to Ahe. It is like pulling teeth to get prices, conditions any details at all. Do you have any reliable contact with a decision maker there?
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SMY Ondina
Registered
Hi TWIME and photog, Thanks so much for your comments. As soon as we get in Nabire area we will contact Ahe resort and Mark so that they teach us how to behave and what are the rules they reccomend to follow not only when diving with the whalesharks but also on how to revert some of our incomes to the community. Although you may know, when you do that directly to a local bupati of a village you are never sure that money is going to be used for the good of the community or would go directly to the pockets of the "strong people" there. Wakatobi Resort for instance, knows a lot about it. It took many years for them to create an evenly distribution of their collaboration with the local communities. What to say about the huge problems in Triton bay which ended up in a reccomendation to all LOBs for not to go there and this lasted 1 full year and not very long ago, some villages in Rajah Ampat were unhappy because they had not received their money from the tags in time and were trying to be paid directly from the LOBs something that we cannot accept because without a proper administration of who pays, how much and when and to whom, the chaos is guaranteed. In the Gahawishri organisation we try to write rules for protecting the areas where we sail and dive, for applying regulations on how to jump in the water when several LOBs meet in a divesite, how to help and collaborate with each other specially in those remote areas and also and extremely important, we name our representatives to talk and negoatiate with NGOs and local authorities. We still have a lot of work to do but this will surely end up guaranteeing that the presence of LOBs in any area in Indonesia will be highly appreciated and welcome by all local communities and will learn how much value we can bring for them and stop the bombfishing and sharkfinning that still happens too often. Our first cruise to the Cenderawasih area is running at this momment, we hope to do things properly from the very beginning and if that is not the case, be sure that it will happen in the folowing cruises. Thanks again you two for all your comments and reccomendations!. It is a pleasure to read and discuss and learn how to improve from buddies like you. Best dives!
Bali Diver
Contributor
@Photog so you been involved with Ondina a lot,thats good,there is no need to really defend Ondina as mentioned before this Paul guy is a bit of fool and there are ways of dealing with things and just because a few things go wrong on a trip,does not mean that Ondina is a bad boat etc.. and as other have pointed out also and Ondina has a good name and been in Raja for some time,you are mentioning Raja and i am on about s/w Cenderawasih.I agree that as far as Raja is concerned it needs to kept protected as it is a special place and actions must be taken against boats coming in and not following the rules and causing damage,this can't be allowed to happen or continue and something divers should look at also,how a boat conduct's itself.
Regarding Ahe Island,surprised that you have had difficulties in the past,lots of info on thread i started here http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/indonesia/398859-ahe-dive-resort-cenderawasih-west-papua.html and direct contact is ahepapua@gmail.com no internet on island and they have to travel to mainland.At the moment Ame who runs things needs to have some treatment in Jakarta soon,so at the moment contact may well be slow.USA Contact i think is Amazing adventures travel,soon website will be ready,which will be good for them.
@Ondina that's a good way at looking at things,let me know how you get on and indeed distribution among communities of funds can alway be difficult.
This all a bit off topic really.
Regarding Ahe Island,surprised that you have had difficulties in the past,lots of info on thread i started here http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/indonesia/398859-ahe-dive-resort-cenderawasih-west-papua.html and direct contact is ahepapua@gmail.com no internet on island and they have to travel to mainland.At the moment Ame who runs things needs to have some treatment in Jakarta soon,so at the moment contact may well be slow.USA Contact i think is Amazing adventures travel,soon website will be ready,which will be good for them.
@Ondina that's a good way at looking at things,let me know how you get on and indeed distribution among communities of funds can alway be difficult.
This all a bit off topic really.
Well that is certainly true - this topic is about Raja Ampat Dive Resort!
It would be good to have a topic to discuss liveaboard and resort behavior concerning reef protection. For sure that is one factor in my choice when I select a dive operation to use for group trips and for my own trips as well.
In my June 2007 newsletter I published a photo of a liveaboard wrecking a reef in Raja Ampat .. right where one of our divers made an AMAZING award winning photo earlier the same day. I called on divers to police the ships they are on... 2007... 5 years ago. I could do the same with some of the resorts' boats. Not all are bad, but some are known for it and are still operating in the area.
SMY Ondina
Registered
Hi buddies, we have just finished two back to back expeditions to the Cenderawasih Bay. Both have been very succesful and allowed the guests to witness the amazing behaviour of this group of unusual resident Whalesharks. You can check photos and comments in our facebook (Welcome to Facebook - Log In, Sign Up or Learn More) and, although in spanish, the blog of the famous reporters Chano Montelongo (http://enbuscadelkraken2.blogspot.com/) and Paco nadal for the number 1 spanish newspaper "El Pais" (Paco Nadal >> El Viajero >> Archivo >> Blogs EL PAÍS) that includes an incredible video on the whalesharks that can also be seen at: Tiburones ballena en la bahi.
@TWIME, Hi buddy, as we were talking about in this thread, the process of settling a collaboration between liveaboards and local communities is building up but still with a lot of confusions in some of the villages arond the Bay. There seems to be no problems with the Nabire/Ahe locals as there is already a set way for the collaborations but in some other parts of the Cenderawsih marine park, rangers and some villagers expect additional payments than the ones done centrally and do still end up in over reactions even with threats from some villagers. It will take sometime like it happened in Triton Bay and even in Rajah Ampat but it is in our hands, the operators, and in the local governments to move fast into regulating the activities in the region on behalf of the locals and on behalf of this Nature wonder: the resident Whalesharks of Cenderawasih bay. We will try to push for it to happen soon.
@TWIME, Hi buddy, as we were talking about in this thread, the process of settling a collaboration between liveaboards and local communities is building up but still with a lot of confusions in some of the villages arond the Bay. There seems to be no problems with the Nabire/Ahe locals as there is already a set way for the collaborations but in some other parts of the Cenderawsih marine park, rangers and some villagers expect additional payments than the ones done centrally and do still end up in over reactions even with threats from some villagers. It will take sometime like it happened in Triton Bay and even in Rajah Ampat but it is in our hands, the operators, and in the local governments to move fast into regulating the activities in the region on behalf of the locals and on behalf of this Nature wonder: the resident Whalesharks of Cenderawasih bay. We will try to push for it to happen soon.
gee13
Contributor
Feeding whalesharks in cenderawasih to attract them does not encourage 'natural behaviour'. What you will end up getting is a domesticated group of whale sharks dependent on being sensitized by such activity. What the divers end up getting is a view of the sharks interacting with their human feeders not dissimilar to an aquarium setup at feeding time.
How is this a conservation is up for debate. Having seen these magnificent creatures truly in the wild filter feeding on plankton I myself personally wouldnt want to see a 'domesticated' setup. Why not just let them be wild and free? What kind of precedent is cenderawasih setting up for future generations of whale sharks in the area?
How is this a conservation is up for debate. Having seen these magnificent creatures truly in the wild filter feeding on plankton I myself personally wouldnt want to see a 'domesticated' setup. Why not just let them be wild and free? What kind of precedent is cenderawasih setting up for future generations of whale sharks in the area?
SMY Ondina
Registered
Hi Gee13, Your point of view is something that comes to our mind very often, specially when we have scientist or filmmakers onboard. At the end of the day if you consider, and you should, mankind part of Nature, this interaction between man and whalesharks in Nabire is 100% Natural. It is not different from the interaction that some thousands years ago started to "change" wolves into actual dogs and we consider it was natural and evolutive. Think about some National Parks in Africa which are the size of the Cenderawasih bay, they are big zoos but animals there still are truly in the wild like the resident whalesharks of Nabire. Eventually they will probably turn "different" from their original behaviours because we, mankind, as a species, have reduced their space till scary limits and change their natural environment radically. We cannot tell how many different species live on human wastes or how many different species have thrived thanks to mankind evolution being so succesful. In this last comment I include from bacteria to mammals when I talk about species.
Thanks Gee13, this is really such an interesting topic that would probably need thousands of words and end up in reconsidering the basics of ethics in our relationship with our environment and the need to stop mankind population growing at the actual rates. Remember the lyrics of that Sparks song?: "This town ain't big enough for both of us. And it ain't me who's gonna leave" If you change town by world and us are mankind and the rest of the species and of course me is humans.........we got a problem! Great topic Gee13!
Thanks Gee13, this is really such an interesting topic that would probably need thousands of words and end up in reconsidering the basics of ethics in our relationship with our environment and the need to stop mankind population growing at the actual rates. Remember the lyrics of that Sparks song?: "This town ain't big enough for both of us. And it ain't me who's gonna leave" If you change town by world and us are mankind and the rest of the species and of course me is humans.........we got a problem! Great topic Gee13!
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