Teenager with DCS, mother in denial, treatment delayed

[Kay Dee]

e.g. on a twin tank / twin regulator set-up, trying to swap regulators to balance his air consumption but kept putting the same regulator back in his mouth. and couldn't understand why one SPG was reading low while the other one wasn't changing. He was fine by the time we took him back to the first deco stop, BTW.)

Using twin independent doubles where one has to switch regs to balance out the pressures is an accident waiting to happen at the best of times! And especially so at depth!!

I watched a person die swapping regs at depth, when he mistakenly switched to o2.

And then a close relation of mine almost died / got bent real bad from exactly what you describe above, that is although he thought he was switching regs he kept, 'seemingly' (as I wasn't there), putting the same one back in his mouth. When that cylinder ran out, and being obviously incapacitated in the 50-60m zone on air, he tried to ascend, passed out, and floated back down where another diver/s found him. They got up him up and back on the boat missing all his deco and 'seemingly' dead, manage to get some life back into him by the time the chopper arrived, and long story short, it turned out to be a case where they thought he would not survive, but he proved them wrong although his diving was over for some years, and his deep diving days were over, period. But now we digress from the thread at hand..

@Dr Simon Mitchell, thanks for the answer re the IWR kit photo, and Miria says to say hi!

 

[Searcaigh]

I watched a person die swapping regs at depth, when he mistakenly switched to o2.

Similar incident off Jeddah earlier this year (or late last year), an Instructor switched from air to 100% O2 at depth in front of two students!

 

[SlugLife]

I really hope he has DAN insurance. A guy recently did a very pedestrian chamber ride in a hospital chamber in the Miami area that would have been ~$40K... but he had DAN so completely covered. This kid is going though something much more extensive.

Extremely doubtful, considering they skimped on treatment & didn't know who to contact for dive-related-medical-advice.

Personally, I would call DAN first. If they think you have possible DCS, they will get you going to the correct facility .... EMTs and emergency room to which he was taken refused to give him early treatment for DCS no matter how much he begged for it.

+100. The #1 reason I got DAN was ensuring I get the right expertise and treatment quickly, and #2 was financial, and to remove any incentive to not get checked out.

On a related note, I also bought another form of "insurance" in the form redundancy, such as a 19cu pony bottle and regs, redundant cutting devices, and redundant flotation (DSMB)

See my post above about 8hrs in ER with nothing at all. Part of why I now have a O2 kit.

Good thinking, I might have to do that soon as well. It's like an insurance policy you only have to buy once (with minimal upkeep).

 

[SlugLife]

So the IWR attempt was unwise, to say the least. But did it actually make things worse in this case? Or was the problem just their refusal to seek the proper treatment, which continued for hours after they returned to shore anyway?

This may have been answered (I'm catching up on posts) "But did it actually make things worse in this case?"

1) Better/worse questions require a "compared to what?" If the comparison is "immediately seek treatment," then absolutely the kid was worse off.

2) The problem with this question, is it assumes things we know in hindsight. For example, if there's a gun accidental discharge which sends a bullet-1 inch from your head, technically you're alive and uninjured. That's a bad metric; because a very minor alteration of something out of your control (wind, twitching, gun-sighting, etc) means you'd be dead.

The untrained-IWR doesn't appear to have helped him much, if any, and may have given a false sense of confidence.

 

[SlugLife]

Using twin independent doubles where one has to switch regs to balance out the pressures is an accident waiting to happen at the best of times! And especially so at depth!!

I watched a person die swapping regs at depth, when he mistakenly switched to o2.

And then a close relation of mine almost died / got bent real bad from exactly what you describe above, that is although he thought he was switching regs he kept, 'seemingly' (as I wasn't there), putting the same one back in his mouth. When that cylinder ran out, and being obviously incapacitated in the 50-60m zone on air, he tried to ascend, passed out, and floated back down where another diver/s found him. They got up him up and back on the boat missing all his deco and 'seemingly' dead, manage to get some life back into him by the time the chopper arrived, and long story short, it turned out to be a case where they thought he would not survive, but he proved them wrong although his diving was over for some years, and his deep diving days were over, period. But now we digress from the thread at hand..

@Dr Simon Mitchell, thanks for the answer re the IWR kit photo, and Miria says to say hi!

I'm going to have to disagree with some nuance. Switching regs itself shouldn't be dangerous to a scuba-diver. Yes, you can do it improperly, but it's generally safe. It's safe enough it's even taught to beginner open-water divers. With sidemount, you're switching tanks/regs VERY frequently.

Any danger from reg-switching or independent air-sources is usually something else.

• Forgetting how to properly switch regs (purge), lack of practice, unable to find reg.
• Not monitoring air, or not switching when a tank runs out.
• Switching to the wrong gas/tank.
• Panicking and just doing the absolute wrong thing.

There are things one can do to improve safety.

• Regulator-retainers/necklaces/clips, and keeping regs in a consistent place.
• Brightly colored hoses, regulator-mouth-pieces, indicating which one it is. (I use "wire protectors") Similarly, you can make them feel different, such as mounting hoses to the left-side, or clipping something to the reg. I currently use blue for left, green for right. I'd probably use bright-orange for deco-gas.
• Simply being in the habit of easily switching regs. So that it's not an emergency if you get a sudden OOA scenario (assuming independent air-sources), you can just switch.
• Always having enough air, in each tanks to safely surface. With independent-air-sources, a failure of any component means you have a complete redundant setup. With linked-systems, a failure could potentially compromise your entire air-source.

 

[Kay Dee]

I'm going to have to disagree with some nuance. Switching regs itself shouldn't be dangerous to a scuba-diver. Yes, you can do it improperly, but it's generally safe. It's safe enough it's even taught to beginner open-water divers. With sidemount, you're switching tanks/regs VERY frequently.

Any danger from reg-switching or independent air-sources is usually something else.

• Forgetting how to properly switch regs (purge), lack of practice, unable to find reg.
• Not monitoring air, or not switching when a tank runs out.
• Switching to the wrong gas/tank.
• Panicking and just doing the absolute wrong thing.

First how often do you think those open water divers practice switching regs (rhetorical question).

Second, the above list is exactly what I am talking about as 'problems / downsides' of using independent doubles (and yes, as you say, there are ways to at least minimize those problems, but not everyone does that).

So I hear what you say @SlugMug, but..................................if your diving with a gas that can't be breathed (safely) at the depth you are at (switching regs) then the opportunity arises that you might, accidentally, switch to that wrong reg (as the very experienced diver did in the first example I gave). So if one can avoid that possibility then one should, IMO, unless as you say one is diving with sidemount (and no doubt have been thoroughly trained / practiced in such).

The second example I gave goes to one of your points (not monitoring gauges regularly, or looking at the 'wrong' gauge), and in the case I describe the person seemingly being too deep on air (for his abilities) to be able to sort through the 'problem' at hand.

 

[SlugLife]

First how often do you think those open water divers practice switching regs (rhetorical question).

I'm answering the rhetorical question anyway. Not often, which is a potential danger, and I'm advocating people do practice, so to eliminate that problem.

About 1-year ago, I was harshly reminded of that during this incident, where I was somewhat unprepared to switch regs quickly while under pressure. It was just a standard, single-tank, regs with octo setup.

Lost Improperly Tightened 2nd-Stage Regulator

This is embarrassing, my fault, and happened a little over a year ago. I'd rather not tell the story, but this was a year ago, and it would be improper for me to not share given I've learned from other's Accidents/Incidents. My dive was around an island, at 20 to 45 feet deep. At about 30...

scubaboard.com

Practice will help you iron out any problems outside an emergency, such as realizing your reg isn't where you expect, or you forget to purge. When you do have an issue, nerves, etc, you should be able to safely and consistently switch.

Second, the above list is exactly what I am talking about as 'problems / downsides' of using independent doubles (and yes, as you say, there are ways to at least minimize those problems, but not everyone does that).

Re-reading your post several times, are you referring to a scenario, where someone has back-mount-independent doubles, and different gasses in each tank? That specific scenario is dangerous.

For the rest, I assert that has nothing to do with reg-switching or independent air-systems.

 

[Kay Dee]

.Re-reading your post several times, are you referring to a scenario, where someone has back-mount-independent doubles, and different gasses in each tank? That specific scenario is dangerous.

For the rest, I assert that has nothing to do with reg-switching or independent air-systems.

To your first question the answer is no, same gas (air).
To your second statement we will just have to agree to disagree on that one.

 

[Nitrox_DiverNY]

Grandma died too?? wow. Very bizarre mother.... I feel bad for the kid

 

[formernuke]

Grandma died too?? wow. Very bizarre mother.... I feel bad for the kid

Only partially, the kid is 18. He should have known better himself.