Some days are harder than others

[eelnoraa]

I am most surprised by the fact you can trim out with steel doubles, steel plates and 8lb bolt on. Most people I know will go toward AL plate to lighten the upper section, then put tail weight to help trim, myself included. I don't have HP120, so can't comment on the weighting, I do use 14lb total with double LP80. That is 2lb AL plate, 8lb on belt, 6lb tail weight.

I am in agreement with other, put the top band back to where it should be (at the crowd), adjust something else to for tank height. Maybe shorten should strap, lengthen crotch strap, maybe you need a bigger plate, maybe you need to proper cut drysuit to let you have free range of motion ....

 

[rhwestfall]

Sure, Ray says it and........

 

[RJP]

I am most surprised by the fact you can trim out with steel doubles, steel plates and 8lb bolt on. Most people I know will go toward AL plate to lighten the upper section, then put tail weight to help trim, myself included.

I dive HP119's with an AL plate and no additional lead in a TLS-350

 

[stuartv]

I am most surprised by the fact you can trim out with steel doubles, steel plates and 8lb bolt on. Most people I know will go toward AL plate to lighten the upper section, then put tail weight to help trim, myself included. I don't have HP120, so can't comment on the weighting, I do use 14lb total with double LP80. That is 2lb AL plate, 8lb on belt, 6lb tail weight.

I am in agreement with other, put the top band back to where it should be (at the crowd), adjust something else to for tank height. Maybe shorten should strap, lengthen crotch strap, maybe you need a bigger plate, maybe you need to proper cut drysuit to let you have free range of motion ....

I am going to take the collective advice and ditch the use of the bolt-on weights, move the bands back up, lengthen my shoulder straps, and go from there.

But, with the OMS wing I have, my first weekend in doubles and drysuit, one of the things I was doing during the course of those dives was swimming along the bottom of the quarry where I was keeping my chest about as close to the bottom as I could - I'd say no more than 6" between my drysuit inflator and the bottom and, I think maybe a bit less - and slowly doing frog kicks where I was paying attention to make sure my knees never touched the bottom. So, I CAN keep decent trim with the double 120s and 14# of weight. Maybe this Halcyon wing is some part of the problem I was having this past weekend.

Regardless, ONE thing I feel like I have learned from this thread is that what I started tweaking was the wrong thing - band position. I will reset and experiment with different things to get myself dialed in. It would definitely be nice to not be lugging that extra 8# of weight in and out of the quarry every time!

---------- Post added October 19th, 2015 at 08:53 PM ----------

With nearly all modern manifolds being 215 mm Center to center tank diameter has very little impact on required wing width.

A pair of 7 inch tanks with a 215mm manifold will be a 1 inch more narrow overall than a pair of 8 inch tanks. OTOH a set of 7 inch tanks with a 185mm manifold vs a 8 inch tanks with a 215 mm manifold will differ by over 2 inches, and that may start to be noticeable with some wings.

Tobin

I measured with my metric/standard tape and I got exactly 215mm, center of tank to center of tank. Just for the record.

 

[eelnoraa]

I dive HP119's with an AL plate and no additional lead in a TLS-350

Yeah, I know quite a few people of similar size to myself, dive Worthington HP100s without any weight. It however doesn't work for me. With TLS-350/XM400 undie, I need 12lb of additional weight with Worthington LP85s, and about 6lb with Worthington HP100s. Weight check by myself and confirmed by 2 GUE instructors, so I guess that can't be too far from reality.

 

[stuartv]

You know, that is true, you did not actually ask for help.

On the other hand, no one really wants to "commiserate", that would be more appropriate if for some reason beyond your control you found out that you were unable to dive doubles.

Our first instinct is to try to help you fix the problem.

Yep. Like I said, I really do appreciate it, too! I was feeling kind of down about the whole thing when I posted. But, the responses have got me feeling much more optimistic about getting things sorted out and actually being able to do well in the class - not just feel like I'm struggling my hardest just to barely complete the skills.

It doesn't hurt that tbone also gave me the justification I've been looking for to maybe finally go ahead and get a lightweight BP. Yeah! I need one for diving wet and one for diving dry. That's it!

 

[tomfcrist]

I agree with most of the points stated...you are likely overweighted, your bands need to go back to the crown, and your shoulder straps are probably too tight.

Your head down trim may very well disappear when you loosen your shoulder straps as well.

It will generally be harder to reach your valves with a drysuit on, but not too much harder. It depends on your suit design and your undergarment.

I don't know what your course schedule is, but it would do you a lot of good to do some shakedown dives in a shallow, benign location in your full intended configuration prior to jumping back into class and trying to do skills. Sometimes the anxiety that stems from being observed/tested by an instructor can be overwhelming, but if you can achieve a decent level of comfort prior to starting the class again you will be much better prepared.

 

[KevinNM]

I'm going to suggest some ideas on reaching your valves based on what I've done. First, can you reach them (with the bands set at the standard height) sitting on a bench in a bathing suit with them fully supported? How about with you standing in a bathing suit with most of the weight on your shoulders. (supporting them a bit helps you not fall down doing this standing up.) In a pool in just a bathing suit? Assuming you can do this, repeat these in your drysuit with out any undergarments. Then with your base layer, then with the base layer and midlayer you use for cold water. If you can reach in them in some configurations but not as you add more thermal protection then the problem is probably your dry suit. That's what mine is (ok, it's also that I seriously messed up a shoulder a decade ago too - hopefully that isn't a problem for you.).

 

[Steve_C]

Perhaps it is just me but before I took a tech course I would want to get some dives in on dry suit and tanks and wing etc. My non-tech recommendation is to go do a bunch of diving with the intended configuration and after you are comfortable and have things better dialed in take the course. Sounds like task loading not even counting the course. What is the rush? You are still new to diving. You want to become old while diving also.

 

[doctormike]

Perhaps it is just me but before I took a tech course I would want to get some dives in on dry suit and tanks and wing etc. My non-tech recommendation is to go do a bunch of diving with the intended configuration and after you are comfortable and have things better dialed in take the course. Sounds like task loading not even counting the course. What is the rush? You are still new to diving. You want to become old while diving also.

Yeah, I had forgotten to mention that. I don't think that anyone should start technical training and diving doubles simultaneously. Just too much to incorporate at the same time. I dived with doubles for two years before starting AN/Deco.

Sorry, Stuart. I know that you hate hearing stuff like that, and I also know that it's a moot point in your case. But maybe for anyone else reading this and considering tech training.