Seeking the DIR Answer: Must DIR Shops be Committed?

[John_B]

I agree 100% with Lynne. From my point of view, one of the best things about DIR is that it is "opt in".

John

 

[robertarak]

Oh, man, Robert, you're going off on the wrong guy. Onfloat is one of the most reasonable and softest-spoken DIR folks we have on the board!

His point is actually a good one. The primary training agencies survive by recruiting -- Enlisting new divers is a huge part of their marketing strategy. GUE professes to have no interest in doing that sort of thing. People come to THEM. You don't see ads for Fundies classes in Scuba Diver magazine (or anywhere else). Mr. Jablonski has said that GUE's vision is not massive expansion of the instructor cadre, but rather, keeping the organization tight enough to maintain extremely high standards.

Onfloat wasn't being rude or dismissive -- He was making a valid point.

Well, I may have to stand corrected. I do listen to those who know more then I. I really didn't mean to "go off", just express my views. I may have taken Onfloats comments in the wrong tone, and in fact I hope I did. Teach me to post pre .

I still think my comments are valid, even if pointed in the wrong direction. I have seen so much "stroke" or "newbie" bashing by some on boards just like this (and here) that it makes me hesitant to go to them as you say...based only on the attitudes. Even if an orginazation wishes to remain small in numbers, it must always look towards new blood, if only to combat attrition. My guess would be that those who are profiting from the DIR community would disagree with the remain small view. But the's just an uneducated guess.

So, if my less then mighty finger was off target, my apologies.

As for,

Sargeant Hulka: "Lighten up, Francis."

 

[TheRedHead]

I have seen so much "stroke" or "newbie" bashing by some on boards just like this (and here) that it makes me hesitant to go to them as you say...based only on the attitudes.

A stroke by definition is an unsafe diver. Don't you think it is in everyone's best interest to objectively criticize them? I don't know anyone here that bashes new divers.

 

[robertarak]

A stroke by definition is an unsafe diver. Don't you think it is in everyone's best interest to objectively criticize them? I don't know anyone here that bashes new divers.

Unsafe by who's standards? That may very well be the problem. Some say that if you don't dive their configuration, you're gonna die! I dive an octo/inflator. Am I unsafe? A stroke?

Although "objectively" is a pleasant word to use in their defense, it is not always a word I would use to describe the attitudes I have seen.

 

[Adobo]

Unsafe by who's standards? That may very well be the problem. Some say that if you don't dive their configuration, you're gonna die! I dive an octo/inflator. Am I unsafe? A stroke?

Although "objectively" is a pleasant word to use in their defense, it is not always a word I would use to describe the attitudes I have seen.

The discussion is slightly more complex than "do it my way or you're gonna die." I'm sure you know that already though.

Personally, I don't really care how other divers are configured. I'm pretty sure they know what they are doing. And unless I am asked, I don't feel it is my place to offer an opinion. I do care how my dive buddies are configured though. Not because I think the way I am configured is the only "right" way to be configured but for a more practical set of reasons.

An example.. a few months back, a person from out of town was diving with us. Though this person had extensive diving experience in his home area, it had been several months since the last time he had dived in MoCal. Anyway, when I looked at him underwater, something did not look right with his rig. He pointed at his SPG and it became clear that he had cross clipped his SPG under his argon bottle. Because of how it was pinned, I had to help him fix it. The error here might have been from lack of practice with argon bottles or it might have been from the usual human error.

On the same day, I saw another "like minded" diver gearing up across the parking lot. As my buddy and I looked across the parking lot, it was very clear that he had done something wrong (he had neglected to put his backup regulator on before stowing his long hose). All we had to do was get his attention and point to the backup regulator and the diver knew right away...

I personally prefer that my dive buddies have a similar configuration as me since I am familiar with it and can quickly spot problems and resolve them before they become an issue. And vice versa. In emergency situations, my buddy's equipment functions as my backup equipment also. Knowing exactly where my buddies keep their backup flashlights, backup masks, SMBs, etc. is a benefit for me. And vice versa.

For me, it is not a matter of are you going to die if you don't do it the way I do it. I'm sure they way you do it and the way others do it is perfectly fine. My personal preference however is to that I am predictable to my buddies and vice versa. That they know quickly if I am behaving in an abnormal fashion. That they can spot minor gear issues and point them out before things become problematic. That if they need to get me out of my gear, they are intimately familiar with the gear so they can do so with minimum delay. All of those things and vice versa.

If some DIR divers are not open to diving with you on some dives, there might be reasons for that. And it is not necessarily because some or all DIR divers are being mean spirited or whatever.

 

[Kevrumbo]

Well, I may have to stand corrected. I do listen to those who know more then I. I really didn't mean to "go off", just express my views. I may have taken Onfloats comments in the wrong tone, and in fact I hope I did. Teach me to post pre .

I still think my comments are valid, even if pointed in the wrong direction. I have seen so much "stroke" or "newbie" bashing by some on boards just like this (and here) that it makes me hesitant to go to them as you say...based only on the attitudes. Even if an orginazation wishes to remain small in numbers, it must always look towards new blood, if only to combat attrition. My guess would be that those who are profiting from the DIR community would disagree with the remain small view. But the's just an uneducated guess.

So, if my less then mighty finger was off target, my apologies.

As for,

Don't apologize . . .you had a valid objection and reaction to Onfloat's glib, flippant and rhetorical bull-scat (I had the same reaction too --Hey onfloat, you want beef brah??? ). I live here in PADI La-La Land (PADI America's HQ is here in So Cal/The OC), and I see hordes of their "product" every single day. If GUE wants to effect (as well as affect) a paradigm shift with their new basic Open Water Program, then it's going to have to change to a kinder/gentler attitude not only with their Staff, but also with present Fundies graduates and members of the current rank and file. . .

 

[RTodd]

This thread should have never survived in the first place since it is a fairly obvious dig at DIR. Now this crap. Lynne, is this board going to be moderated or should it be abandoned as useless?

 

[boomx5]

Hmmm. I've never dived with a GUE-trained diver whom I felt unsafe. Have you?

I have.

 

[David Watson]

That's interesting. If you become a GUE instructor you're actually monitored and if you dive outside DIR protocols openly, you're out?
That seems a bit extreme. As long as you officially teach within the rules, what does GUE care if an instructor dives 150 feet on air on his/her own time? Or uses non DIR gear sometimes? Do they even have a legal right to revoke one's license for that?

A GUE instructor who dives 150 feet on air should be fired. He obviously doesn't understand the meaning behind the things that he is teaching. The whole point of these classes is to get you to understand WHY you are doing the things you do. Neutral buoyancy and good trim are important, but not near as important as the ability to handle any situation underwater and return to the surface safely. This ability comes from a good strong mental awareness underwater.

This would compare to someone who speaks publically for PETA hanging out with Michael Vick on the weekends. I think PETA might have a problem with that.

 

[Hank49]

This thread should have never survived in the first place since it is a fairly obvious dig at DIR. Now this crap. Lynne, is this board going to be moderated or should it be abandoned as useless?

If it bothers you, don't read it. Pull the stick out....get on with your life.