Resort's " New Normal " Rule - No AIR 2 or diving your long hose

[tursiops]

Nope, you still don't get it and probably never will. Sigh.

Ditto.

 

[CAPTAIN SINBAD]

I am still trying to understand the livability of Covid-19 in water. This article explains a lot of things that may be useful for divers.

Can COVID-19 Coronavirus Live In Water? What About Drinking Water And Swimming

It appears that while Covid germs may live in water for a few days, they will not be in quantities large enough to cause infection. I am not sure how this applies to a regulator that has gone from an infectious person's mouth into water and then into another persons mouth since air share is a submerged activity. Would the immersion neutralize Covid germs enough to the point where the regulator is no longer infectious? Based on the above article, I am understanding the risk to be low enough where in case of an air share situation, it should not be a concern.

Add to this the fact that if you are diving with a Covid infectious dive buddy then you probably did not meet them in the water. You probably took a boat ride with them, discussed the dive plan and social distancing was not happening. Your being on the boat with that person has already exposed you to a much higher risk even before you jumped in the water. Having these air share procedures while you have already been exposed to the person up top in an open air environment does not make any sense unless I am missing something?

If someone has other conclusions then I would love to know your reasons.

 

[loosenit2]

 

[The Chairman]

Would the immersion neutralize Covid germs enough to the point where the regulator is no longer infectious? Based on the above article, I am understanding the risk to be low enough where in case of an air share situation, it should not be a concern.

No one can answer this question with any amount of authority. However, it's been established that Covid-19 has only been spread by being around other people breathing. Apparently, it has to be aerosolized close by in order for you to be infected. The chances of you being infected by a mouthpiece from an infected person is probably infinitesimal compared to the exposure you're getting ON THE BOAT with the same infected person. Can it happen? We don't know. Can you be infected while on the boat with a non-symptomatic person? Of course, we know you can. Are the very credible fears being addressed by this new rule? Only by those who simply want to believe they are. It's a nothing burger so far to me. I will be diving abroad as soon as I feel it's safe for me. I'm not feeling that at this point for any resort. I would probably be more open to a liveaboard before any resort. More room. Fewer interactions. I can see me pre-breathing my SF2 for a long, long time when I do go diving.

Make no doubt about it: most every decision made about Covid-19 are made by intuition, ie your gut. While we've figured out a few things that won't work, we still have no idea of what will work. New rules based on someone else's intuition will always be met with resistance. What would any reasonable person expect? I'm going to do what's right for me. If you tell me I have to break my training, then I expect a viable solution to replace that training. That's IF they want me to come visit them.

 

[D_Fresh]

Based on the information posted by @CAPTAIN SINBAD , which was primarily focused on freshwater, with only a mention of salt water ocean, I think in-water transmission would be highly unlikely.... Plus, not only does seawater contain salt, but also iodine, which could, potentially, also be effective at killing the virus, especially at such low viral concentration.... But as pointed out by @The Chairman , any transmissible exposure to the virus would most likely happen pre or post dive above the surface. IMO, to me, that means pick your dive partners carefully; maybe skip the charter and go shore diving with your close buddies who you're pretty confident are not infected....

Back to the original topic of the thread, Their Resort, Their Rules, but no long hose and no Air2? Sorry, won't be getting my money, period! I was diving long hose primary with Airsource then simply added long hose Octo because of "tourist standards" in my area, which I am likely enough to encounter. So I just made my setup friendly enough for them. (plus I added custom mouthpiece to my primary). Sorry, if an operator tells me that my setup is unacceptable at his place or on his boat, I will not be patronizing their business, plain and simple.

 

[beaverdivers]

You can't just look at the likelihood of occurrence, you also have to look at the severity of the consequences of the occurrence. Risk is usually defined as consequence x likelihood. If you want to keep it simple (which seems a good idea for this thread) suppose there are three levels of likelihood (low, medium, high) and three levels of consequences (low = annoyance, medium = have to deal with it but it is not life threatening, and high = life-threatening). So, I suspect we would all agree that the likelihood of running out of air is low, but the consequences are high. So the risk involved with running out of air is not negligible, even if the likelihood of it is low. So we train for it and equip for it, to try and mitigate the consequence and thus lower the risk.

What's not said in your post is that you seem to be concerned about the joint likelihood of running out of air and either (a) Covid-19 is involved in either the donor or receipient, or (b) whether the consequences of having been forced to just change your standard equipment configuration causes you to respond less well to an OOG incident. Some posters in this thread are in the (a) category, some are in the (b). In the (a) category the concern is lowered likelihood of both OOG and Covid-19 happening, but since the consequences are still high (even higher, perhaps) it doesn't change the risk assessment. In the (b) category, we are perhaps less able to mitigate the consequence so the risk is higher.
Either way, the precautionary principle has been applied by Buddy Dive, which makes good sense until more is known.

Taking my last group trip to Bonaire as an example, we had ZERO ( 0% ) OOA occurrences X Covid-19 in either donor or recipient.

Using the present global numbers, there are 6.2 million case out of a global population of 7.8 billion. 6.2 million / 7.8 billion = 0.000794871795Then take my 0 OOA X .00079 = ZERO!

How many OOA events did you have on your last group trip to Bonaire?

 

[tursiops]

Taking my last group trip to Bonaire as an example, we had ZERO ( 0% ) OOA occurrences X Covid-19 in either donor or recipient.

Using the present global numbers, there are 6.2 million case out of a global population of 7.8 billion. 6.2 million / 7.8 billion = 0.000794871795Then take my 0 OOA X .00079 = ZERO!

How many OOA events did you have on your last group trip to Bonaire?

Why do you even carry an octo?

 

[saxman242]

Why do you even carry an octo?

You're talking a difference of several orders of magnitude in risk there...

 

[beaverdivers]

Why do you even carry an octo?

I always dive with a pony or redundant independent air source. I believe everyone should. Perhaps one of the positives derived from this crisis, would be that a " New Normal Higher Standard " is achieved. Every diver must have a redundant independent air source.

 

[MichaelMc]

The known transmission path: droplets in air.

Now speculating:
* Locking lips: Likely rather high.
* Slobbering on something, passing in air, to be slobbered on: Also likely high.
* Being in the same pool as someone: Apparently low

* Slobbering on, passing quickly, to be slobbered on, in water:
How much of the slobber got off in those 5 seconds? Did you swirl it around a lot? Rub on the mouth piece? Rub on the insides? Flush the insides with water a few times?