Recreational Pony Bottles, completely unnecessary? Why or why not?

[Hartattack]

I look at a pony bottle on a regular dive as just a fail safe in case your main system has a sudden and complete failure. If you carry a pony in case you run your primary cylinder(s) dry then you should give up diving as you are unable to pay attention and dive safely as there is no excuse for simply running out of air.

Additionally, having a sudden failure of your primary system at depth could create a chain of events that could have a catastrophic outcome that may have been easily managed with an independent second air source. I would rather self-rescue in this type of scenario. With that said, you need to weigh the probability of your main system having a complete failure that would necessitate the need for a pony. Even though the chances are very low, some folks decide to further manage the possibility and carry a pony.

Hi DAj,

Some good points, do you think your scenario could be mitigated by the use of back or side mounted doubles?

Side-note: I do not believe the use of doubles is technical or advanced and can be used just fine if taught correctly in a recreational setup. IMHO, they are the better option to a pony bottle.

 

[Searcaigh]

The idea of a pony bottle for recreational diving, in my opinion, is a marketing gimmick to dumb down dive planning and also sell more unnecessary equipment to appease the industry's bottom line.

I don't pay too much attention to OW courses these days as I generally don't see many OW students or divers on the boats I dive from. However, I have yet to see any OW instructor push pony bottles on any of the students in the region where I dive.

Is the concept of using a pony bottle being marketed to OW only qualified divers anywhere?

Has any agency set up a course for using a pony bottle for OW only qualified divers?

The only course where I've seen the pony bottle being introduced has been PADI's Self Reliant Diver and I assume other agency Solo Diver courses where divers need a minimum number of 100 logged dives.

 

[KenGordon]

In the other thread there were views for and against new divers using a pony.

Sometimes a pony is appropriate. For me it is for shore dives with buddies I do not know. I want some redundancy in case I have a failure but cannot be sure I will be close enough to my buddy to get gas. I’d much rather use a twinset or rebreather but logistics can prevent that. Even with divers you know, it gives more room for swimming about and not being completely focused on your buddy and so reduces anxiety.

A problem with them is that they are only a help in a relatively narrow band of depths. That combined with people choosing very small ones means they need to be treated with care. Then there is the business of extra complexity giving more ways to get it badly wrong.

 

[Hartattack]

I don't pay too much attention to OW courses these days as I generally don't see many OW students or divers on the boats I dive from. However, I have yet to see any OW instructor push pony bottles on any of the students in the region where I dive.

Is the concept of using a pony bottle being marketed to OW only qualified divers anywhere?

Has any agency set up a course for using a pony bottle for OW only qualified divers?

The only course where I've seen the pony bottle being introduced has been PADI's Self Reliant Diver and I assume other agency Solo Diver courses where divers need a minimum number of 100 logged dives.

Great question. The use of a pony bottle for an OW diver is being pushed here on SB.

 

[johndiver999]

My vote, unnecessary.

A diver should be able to calculate what’s on their back (or side) and set aside a minimum gas (reserve) for an emergency in their dive plan. The added weight, drag, and configuration would hinder a recreational diver more in an emergency than it would help.

All dive plans and ideas are welcome.

Side-note: I do not dive solo, so there could be a reason for those folks, but I’d like to keep this in the normal rec realm of scuba.

Considering the frequency of people getting separated from their buddies in recreational diving, it is pretty clear that a pony bottle provides some benefits.

The primary benefit of a pony bottle should be to offset catastrophic gear failure, but I would be willing to bet (that in practice) they are used more often to offset carelessness in watching air supply.

They do add complexity and an additional entanglement hazard.

Are they completely necessary? Depends on the environment and the diver and their willingness to accept (largely undefinable) risks.

Are they appropriate for a new diver? A lot of subjectivity comes into play - obviously the training agencies don't think so and are satisfied with the accident rate associated with the current situation.

 

[loosenit2]

In my mind the question is not whether it is necessary, it is whether a diver has been trained in its use. I use doubles, deco bottles, stage bottles and occasionally pony bottles. All have their place, the important thing is that a diver has put in the work to make their use a matter of muscle memory. A redundant source of air does little good if a diver does not know how to get to it.

 

[DAJ]

Hi DAj,
do you think your scenario could be mitigated by the use of back or side mounted doubles?

I would say that any independent air source can mitigate the potential issues as long as the system is used properly and monitored. Doubles are easy as you simply switch regs and isolate the problem. If however you run your doubles down to empty by not paying attention, you still have the same problem. The issue that you might run into with new/inexperienced divers is that most are going to be running a single cylinder. A pony is just the easiest and most economic means of adding redundancy to a single system.

I have seen these issues over the years come and go. I recall when many folks could be seen with a pony mounted to their single cylinder. I still see them every now and then but slinging a pony is more common for those going this route these days. Whatever system is used, folks need to practice and become proficient with it. Simply slinging a pony or running doubles won’t help much when things go sideways and the diver is not familiar with how to respond.

 

[johndiver999]

Perhaps it would be interesting to outline what minimum training is necessary for a diver to make use of a pony bottle? It doesn't seem all that complicated to me.

We have OW divers who have just been certified the prior day, doing a night dive in an AOW class and that doesn't seem to cause too much heartburn for a lot of people, yet I think a night dive is probably more challenging and intimidating than wearing a pony bottle - for a new diver.

 

[Hartattack]

In my mind the question is not whether it is necessary, it is whether a diver has been trained in its use. I use doubles, deco bottles, stage bottles and occasionally pony bottles. All have their place, the important thing is that a diver has put in the work to make their use a matter of muscle memory. A redundant air source does little good if a diver does not know how to get to it.

Well said. With that in mind, I’ve seen very experienced divers (myself included) lose their stability and buoyancy while being handed a simple task in a course of instruction in 30ft of water. The thought of handing an OW diver a new set of tools when fundamental/basic skills might not have been met is a little concerning to me from my perspective.

 

[Searcaigh]

Again I will comment from personal experience from where I dive, which is mainly from boats doing predominantly square profile dives in the region of 20-30m depths.

I know of only five other divers besides myself who carry pony bottles. One of them is my regular buddy and she is also a photographer. However we are both trained in deco diving so our ponies are filled with EAN50 which gives us an option on our deeper dives to plan for deco if necessary (not to be discussed here).

Two of the other divers use EAN32 in their ponies at present and the other two guys who are also a photographers use air.

There are a number of side mount divers who by default are carrying sufficient gas to manage an OOG / OOA situation but I would group them in Advanced and not Basic, likewise for people using backmounted twinsets, where twinsets are generally a starting point for Tech diving. I do recreational dives with twinsets too because I love my twin AL50s