Reason for RH release waist buckle?

[lairdb]

Personally, I teach that harnesses should have right hand release on left side of the crotchstrap. That way, if a diver is upright and ditch both weight belt and opens the harness, the weight belt will come off, as the harness will open cleanly (unless there's unreasonable amount of excess webbing.)

Conventional rescue efforts become much easier too, when the buckle cannot get caught in the crotchstrap.

Do you have a cutting tool (trilobite, etc.) on the waist strap? Where does that go?

 

[crofrog]

The right hand release is 90% canister light related I'd imagine. Today, with better and better lights, that's perhaps less of a concern for most.

Personally, I teach that harnesses should have right hand release on left side of the crotchstrap. That way, if a diver is upright and ditch both weight belt and opens the harness, the weight belt will come off, as the harness will open cleanly (unless there's unreasonable amount of excess webbing.)

Conventional rescue efforts become much easier too, when the buckle cannot get caught in the crotchstrap.

Why would you want it to be easy to remove

 

[mdwalter]

in a rescue/ assist you would be facing the vic and his left handed buckle for the weight belt would be a right handed operation for you.

Not really - think about the mechanics of your right hand in respect to operating the buckle on someone else you are facing. Their right hand buckle can be opened with your right hand easily, much as you would open your own right hand buckle (thumb up). Their left hand buckle would require you to either turn your right hand upside down (thumb down) and reach across to open a left handed buckle (or open it with your right thumb instead of your fingers).

 

[Wallowa]

Late to this discussion but would like to pose questions: For decades the weight belt was always put on last and was over the other straps/harnesses to avoid the belt being hung up if dropped in an emergency; likewise the convention was that the weight belt buckle was always a right hand release to avoid confusion if a rescuer had to release a weight belt under emergency/stress conditions without looking to find the buckle. What has changed and why the dichotomy of buckle release directions and why would the weight belt be placed under a crotch strap? Not judging current protocols. Whether horse collar, stab jackets or wings any BCD or bottle retention strap over a weight belt strap can stop the drop of the weight belt at a time when confusion and stress is at a maximum. Weight belts need to drop free without release of other equipment or straps. if you fear premature release of your weight belt, then it is not correctly configured and buckle is inadequate.

Also the question was asked why would someone release the bottles/BCDs straps. In an emergency involving a surface swim the less gear the better; assuming you do not subscribe to the tenet that a snorkel is useless and should not be carried . Dropping gear to survive does not now seem to be often taught or envisioned. Likewise towing a diver during an assist or rescue may be a lot easier without the drag of gear.

Individualizing your gear so you know exactly what is where and the sequences are practiced to manipulate that equipment is a primary responsibility of each diver. However in an emergency standard locations and sequences allows all dive team members to effect an expeditious and effectual rescue or assist. Solo divers likewise need to act effectively when gear manipulations are needed but to do so without relying on another diver for assistance.

Yes, I am old school [drop my mask around my neck not on forehead or back of head to make certain the surf does not remove it] and today's plethora of "the right way" of diving and gear configuration has some merit for specific applications, but only if it serves a necessary function and there is not a better way to accomplish the goals. One size does not fit all and my way or anyone else's may not be the best for all divers under all dive conditions.

Sorry for being so long winded.....

 

[lowwall]

Late to this discussion but would like to pose questions: For decades the weight belt was always put on last and was over the other straps/harnesses to avoid the belt being hung up if dropped in an emergency; likewise the convention was that the weight belt buckle was always a right hand release to avoid confusion if a rescuer had to release a weight belt under emergency/stress conditions without looking to find the buckle. What has changed and why the dichotomy of buckle release directions and why would the weight belt be placed under a crotch strap? Not judging current protocols. Whether horse collar, stab jackets or wings any BCD or bottle retention strap over a weight belt strap can stop the drop of the weight belt at a time when confusion and stress is at a maximum. Weight belts need to drop free without release of other equipment or straps. if you fear premature release of your weight belt, then it is not correctly configured and buckle is inadequate.

Also the question was asked why would someone release the bottles/BCDs straps. In an emergency involving a surface swim the less gear the better; assuming you do not subscribe to the tenet that a snorkel is useless and should not be carried . Dropping gear to survive does not now seem to be often taught or envisioned. Likewise towing a diver during an assist or rescue may be a lot easier without the drag of gear.

Standardizing on right hand release still makes sense for the reason you gave.

OTOH dumping lead as a primary response to underwater problems is no longer valid. When diving meant solo spearfishing with a single 72 cubic foot tank and no wetsuit and BCD, getting to the surface fast was a reasonable emergency plan for most problems. Better than drowning and your nitrogen loading was probably low enough to avoid severe DCS symptoms.

But today we have much greater ability to solve problems underwater with redundant gas from a buddy or additional cylinder. We can stay neutrally buoyant throughout the dive. We very likely need additional weight to keep the ascent rate under control as our wetsuits uncompress. And we often operate much closer to no-deco limits simply because we have the gas to do it meaning a fast ascent is more likely to result in major DCS problems. Speaking of which, we now recognize the additional DCS risks of a fast ascent all the way to the surface.

All of this argues for keeping the lead on until you reach the surface. Once there you have the time to make an informed decision about what if anything should be ditched.

 

[Wallowa]

Standardizing on right hand release still makes sense for the reason you gave.

OTOH dumping lead as a primary response to underwater problems is no longer valid. When diving meant solo spearfishing with a single 72 cubic foot tank and no wetsuit and BCD, getting to the surface fast was a reasonable emergency plan for most problems. Better than drowning and your nitrogen loading was probably low enough to avoid severe DCS symptoms.

But today we have much greater ability to solve problems underwater with redundant gas from a buddy or additional cylinder. We can stay neutrally buoyant throughout the dive. We very likely need additional weight to keep the ascent rate under control as our wetsuits uncompress. And we often operate much closer to no-deco limits simply because we have the gas to do it meaning a fast ascent is more likely to result in major DCS problems. Speaking of which, we now recognize the additional DCS risks of a fast ascent all the way to the surface.

All of this argues for keeping the lead on until you reach the surface. Once there you have the time to make an informed decision about what if anything should be ditched.

Don't dispute your premises but it seems to me that one size does not fit all situations....dumping you weights [belt] can be a primary or a secondary option depending on the need to either surface or stay at the surface...how quickly that response must be executed depends on a host of variables...but dumping weights can be used to either establish buoyancy or neutrally buoyancy...dependency on alternate air sources, buddy assists while are useful may not be available or not available in time or distance. In spite of more gear intensive protocols and dives pushing the limits the ultimate safety solutions rest with the individual in trouble. Yes fast ascents are now again [early days it was 25fpm/smallest bubbles] recognized as safer to ward off DCI and with the huge number of bottles I see folks attaching to themselves it requires closer attention to critical tissue loads but it still comes back to the competence of the individual diver and their ability to correctly manage any "what if" by themselves. I dive a lot solo but even when teaching/supervising I pushed that you need to train up and prepare for handling worst case scenarios by yourself; relying on equipment or the actions of another will not always get you home safely. Nowadays in my opinion divers are becoming too reliant on more and more gear rather than being competent and well grounded in all aspects and skills for self-reliance.

Dropping all your gear, weight belt first, may be a requisite for saving your life. The clock is ticking from surface to surface and assuring the return to surface might necessitate a buoyant ascent. Drowning if you don't return to the surface negates the consequences of DCS or AGE. law of the limits. To not have that option in your training or preparations for the Black Swans events that might require thinking past dogma while exercising skills that could have saved your life is in my world inexcusable.

As always, I could be wrong!

 

[crofrog]

Weight belts need to drop free without release of other equipment or straps. if you fear premature release of your weight belt, then it is not correctly configured and buckle is inadequate.

Risk	Vulnerability	Threat	Probability	Impact	Mitigation Strategies	Residual Risk
DCI due to buoyant ascent	Inadequate securing of weight belt	Something accidentally releasing the buckle	Moderate	High	Placement of weight belt under the crotch strap of the harness on the backplate and wing.	Reduced but still present due to potential equipment failure or improper setup.
Slower removal of weight belt due to placement under crotch strap	Delay in emergency weight ditching	Loss of buoyancy due to wing failure or OOG requiring buoyant ascent	Low	High	Redundant gas sources, team diving protocols, balanced rig or dry suit for redundant buoyancy.	Negligible with proper mitigation strategies.

 

[rx7diver]

... For decades the weight belt was always put on last and was over the other straps/harnesses to avoid the belt being hung up if dropped in an emergency... Weight belts need to drop free without release of other equipment or straps. ...

Some of us here still believe this and, so, still dive this way. (My initial training was NAUI/YMCA, in 1986.)

rx7diver

 

[Wallowa]

Risk	Vulnerability	Threat	Probability	Impact	Mitigation Strategies	Residual Risk
DCI due to buoyant ascent	Inadequate securing of weight belt	Something accidentally releasing the buckle	Moderate	High	Placement of weight belt under the crotch strap of the harness on the backplate and wing.	Reduced but still present due to potential equipment failure or improper setup.
Slower removal of weight belt due to placement under crotch strap	Delay in emergency weight ditching	Loss of buoyancy due to wing failure or OOG requiring buoyant ascent	Low	High	Redundant gas sources, team diving protocols, balanced rig or dry suit for redundant buoyancy.	Negligible with proper mitigation strategies.

Two more cents of opinion.......over the years the only weight belt buckle that I feel is truly safe in that it tightly connects the ends of the weight belt and is almost fool proof [a really good fool can defeat anything...] in preventing an 'accidental release' but which can quickly and completely be released with a single movement is a wire 'bail' metal to metal buckle....I use a belt with three small bungies in the back of webbing to compensate for wet suit compression with depth, they keep the belt in place and tight.

Additionally I trained my divers to not simple "drop" your weight belt but to retain a grip on either end and pull the belt away from the body before releasing it and dropping it....even this technique does not eliminate a fouling of the weight belt if there is an overlaying crotch strap, especially in a time imperative state of panic....last on first off.

I disagree with "mitigation strategies" listed above if weight belt is under the crotch strap...if you are of necessity dropping the weight belt in an emergency none of these 'strategies' may be available or can be executed in time to save you. Emergencies are time limiting. To me these supposed solutions to a weight belt hung up on a crotch strap are like Dumbo's feather....acts of faith...that may not only not constitute a 'negligible' risk but may prove to be fatal assumptions.

Again, these are only my experiences and opinions and I could be wrong. To each their own.

 

[crofrog]

I disagree with "mitigation strategies" listed above if weight belt is under the crotch strap...if you are of necessity dropping the weight belt in an emergency none of these 'strategies' may be available or can be executed in time to save you. Emergencies are time limiting. To me these supposed solutions to a weight belt hung up on a crotch strap are like Dumbo's feather....acts of faith...that may not only not constitute a 'negligible' risk but may prove to be fatal assumptions.

If you're diving a balanced rig, with redundancy gas and redundant buoyancy, when would you need to drop weights?