Pros and cons of "fixed" D rings in cold water

[Colliam7]

... but I would be interested in logical discussion on the pros and cons of fixed D rings on hog rigs. DIR seems to seriously frown on them, but in extremely cold water environments, they make things WAY easier to attach/unclip from your shoulder and waist. ,,, but focusing on clipping/unclipping items from non-fixed D rings in low vis with heavy gloves or mitts diminishes your situational awareness and bandwidth.

I started using fixed D-rings (hip only) for just that reason - ease of access / use when wearing thicker gloves, and trying to clip several bottles to the hip ring. I even bought a couple of the Dive Rite extra large rigid rings, which allow you to alter the orientation of the ring. Some argue that rigid / fixed D-rings change your profile (as noted), others suggest they are actually a potential source of entanglement. I don't know if either concern is that critical. But, I ultimately returned to standard - flat - D-rings on my hip and found I prefer that. Yes, I had to work to learn how to easily clip and unclip (and 'feel' the position of the ring with my hands encased in thicker gloves), but I have found that for me they are actually as easy, if not easier, to use compared to rigid D-rings.

 

[stmichael]

All good stuff. Don't intend to be Martin Luther challenging DIR methodology, still just asking "why not a fixed D ring?". For the sake of argument its battles2a5 asking instead of me and training/experience etc is no issue at all, just that he prefers them on long, cold dive. I have heard no logical explanation other than "its not DIR".

 

[spectrum]

You started with a logical analysis and no gross oversights were presented. Just make a decision and dive. To let it be a committee decision is like asking to be a giraffe or an ostrich.

Dive ability (reach, mobility, flexibility) and gear layout will all vary and everything has trade-offs.

Pete

 

[Rick Inman]

The argument that, why not do what's easier?, doesn't work for me. I prefer to try to do what seems optimal for me.

I got used to using a standard D ring on all areas of my kit. I don't have one bent ring here, and one straight ring there, and another fixed ring over there. Mine are all the same (I use the bent ring). I like having my rig standardized. And I wouldn't want those fixed rings sticking out from my shoulders and my waist. I like them lying flat. If I want the waist ring to stick straight out for a stage clip or something, I just give a slight outward pull on the spg and it sticks straight out like a fixed D ring. But then I can put it back flat out of the way. However with the fixed ring, there is no pushing it flat, or back, or wherever you want. So to me the loss of flexibility, the straight out profile and the fact that I like all my rings matching have me preferring not to use fixed D rings with my kit.

 

[Blackwood]

As noted in the topic, it's a game of pros and cons.

The reason I use bent d-rings on my shoulders is to make clipping in easier. If using a fixed d-ring somewhere improves the OP's efficiency (i.e. frees his hands more quickly), and if there aren't any reasonably negative consequences (such as snag hazards) to doing so, I say go for it.

On the shoulders, it would aggravate me to no end having my backup lights lie flat and the boltsnaps angle out at like 45° to that kind of clip. But on the hip, yah sure why not.

 

[RJP]

Non-fixed bent D rings on my shoulders, flat d-rings on butt and crotch, fixed d-ring on my hips. (I have one on left and right)

There would be no reason to use fixed d-rings on your shoulders.

On left hip with stages, SPG, your plate, your wing, and your regular tanks, there ain't no way a fixed d-ring "sticks out" far enough to change your profile. On right hip it doesn't stick out any further than my can light, so no problem there either. Even if they DID stick out a bit there's no real, practical way that a fixed D-ring creates any more of an entanglement hazard than a flat d-ring. In fact, given the shape of a d-ring there's really no practical way they could create an entanglement hazard at all unless you're diving in a sea of suicide clips!

However, to be clear: by fixed D-ring I think we're all talking about one of these:

I would steer clear of 45 degree d-rings...

...or so called "drop" d-rings...

...or anything similar...

As these could indeed create a line-trap.

 

[DA Aquamaster]

I agree with RJP - with the added exception that a fixed D-ring potentially creates one more item that can possibly wedge you in position in a tight restriction where you are not wearing a stage, etc.

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I also agree with the DIR view expressed view that equipment should not be used to rememdy a skills deficit. But having made many very long and deep dives in 33 degree water, I can attest that sometimes all the training and practice in the world may not be enough to allow you to easily clip your SPG onto a flat D-ring in extremly cold water with hands that are chilled, numb and lacking in their normal dexterity. Training will allow you to do it, but being able to hit the ring every time in one pass in warm water means nothing when your hands are cold. Training will still allow you to clip into a flat D-ring but some delay is inevitable at least some of the time, and after awhile you have to ask yourself why you keep doing it that very un-optimum way.

In that case, a bent D-ring is a good compromise as it presents no real wedging or line trapping potential, but does stand up a bit more and is easier to find and "feel" with cold hands when clipping something to it.

Another very optimum, but apparently very non DIR solution for the purists, in that exteme cold water situation is to just clip the SPG to the left chest D-ring temprarily. In theory it creates a line trap, but in practice, the deco and stage bottle on the left side have already created a much larger one so it is a moot point.

I am all about thinking things through and doing what works while keeping it simple in order to be as optimum as possible on a given dive in light of real world conditions.

 

[caveandreas]

If you dive, and bring so little thermal insulation that your fingers do not work at the end of the dive you should not dive there in the first place. Your decompression will be ineffective, and this type of hypothermia is never good for you. If you find yourself diving in a place that is so cold, and for so long that your fingers can't operate the boltsnaps/drings the only solution is to bring more thermal insulation.

The body will "abandon" your armes and legs before you body so if you start feeling cold on your hands so better golves is maybe not the solution, but propper isolation of your body is. Anyway, I will always recommend drygloves in cold water (below 8C).

 

[Meng_Tze]

Let's look at this realistically and in perspective. You would have to be frikin' CLOSE to a line to have it snag on your D-ring, whatever the shape or it being fixed or not. More likely than not, you would have already been snagged on your fins, stages or anything else. So a fixed D-ring being a 'snagging danger' is in my opinion an exaggeration unless you do exploratory small restriction type of diving.

If you specifically get snagged on a fixed D-ring while swimming through anything else than a major/no mount restriction with a line, I would argue that you have awareness issues rather than a gear issue.

And then, if that happens, you can (or should be able to) cut loose without effort or panic.

BUT, from a uniformity perspective, it makes no sense to have all kinds of different D-rings on your gear. Especially when diving in teams and a buddy needs to help out. That is where having the same type of equipment becomes beneficial.

 

[DA Aquamaster]

If you dive, and bring so little thermal insulation that your fingers do not work at the end of the dive you should not dive there in the first place. Your decompression will be ineffective, and this type of hypothermia is never good for you. If you find yourself diving in a place that is so cold, and for so long that your fingers can't operate the boltsnaps/drings the only solution is to bring more thermal insulation.

The body will "abandon" your armes and legs before you body so if you start feeling cold on your hands so better golves is maybe not the solution, but propper isolation of your body is. Anyway, I will always recommend drygloves in cold water (below 8C).

I won't argue the point, as I agree, and I am not talking about divining in a hypothermic condition, but ratehr with heavy undergarments and dry gloves. You do lose some feel in near freezing water either due to cool hands and/or due to the dry gloves and liners. Either way it is not the same as using your bare hands in 70 degree water.

Again, a bent D-ring just makes sense if it means the difference between hitting it in a smooth motion on the first try or having to take 2 or 3 wacks at a flat D-ring.