Pre-rigged SMB - Acceptable?

[rjack321]

So, you're only diving thirds on your deco dives then?

Generally halves of usable.

I don't know about the PNW, but in MoCal I cannot see a legit use for a safety spool in a "lost buddy" situation.

What is you lost buddy protocol? You don't do a search from a "last seen" point?

Granted if you have 100ft vis on a reef there's little point in using a 100ft spool to sweep around. But on a wreck where someone could have accidentally penetrated or in poorer vis like Limeyx and I had last month up here (4 maybe 8ft in places) your best and only option is to use a spool to search.

And if you are down to executing a lost buddy search, you'll probably be leaving that spool/line, so having an extra to the pre-rigged SMB is prudent. The disassembly time isn't too big a deal, its that one spool only gives you a few options. I.e. searching now or sending up an SMB later. Bringing 1 pre-rigged and a spare for "other" purposes is pretty easy. So for beyond recreational diving, there's little reason not to.

 

[nadwidny]

And if you are down to executing a lost buddy search, you'll probably be leaving that spool/line, so having an extra to the pre-rigged SMB is prudent. The disassembly time isn't too big a deal, its that one spool only gives you a few options. I.e. searching now or sending up an SMB later. Bringing 1 pre-rigged and a spare for "other" purposes is pretty easy. So for beyond recreational diving, there's little reason not to.

In real life if someone gets separated in OW situations there is sweet FA that a 75 or 100' spool can do to re-establish contact except waste time and gas. And even less so when scooters are involved.

 

[Peter Guy]

Back to M's original question -- especially as it applies to DIR-F.

I know the "standard" requires that you assemble and shoot the bag rather than have it pre-rigged, but would the ADA require GUE to permit the use of a pre-rigged bag given M's disability? Would it be a "reasonable accomodation" to permit him to use a pre-rigged bag given that in DIR-F land, the ONLY use for a spool is to shoot a bag?

 

[rainman_02]

Generally halves of usable.



What is you lost buddy protocol? You don't do a search from a "last seen" point?

Granted if you have 100ft vis on a reef there's little point in using a 100ft spool to sweep around. But on a wreck where someone could have accidentally penetrated or in poorer vis like Limeyx and I had last month up here (4 maybe 8ft in places) your best and only option is to use a spool to search.

And if you are down to executing a lost buddy search, you'll probably be leaving that spool/line, so having an extra to the pre-rigged SMB is prudent. The disassembly time isn't too big a deal, its that one spool only gives you a few options. I.e. searching now or sending up an SMB later. Bringing 1 pre-rigged and a spare for "other" purposes is pretty easy. So for beyond recreational diving, there's little reason not to.

See, you have just identified the difference between "overhead" and overhead.

"Overhead" -- You're on a non-thirds dive. AKA, you do not have to return to the point you entered the water. You're not running a line, and you don't need a safety spool. Therefore the "don't take it if you don't need it" principle applies. It is just another spool to come untangled in your pocket at an untoward time.

Overhead -- You're on a thirds dive. Cave, wreck pen, or a tech dive where you must return to the point you entered. You're running a line, and you need a separate safety spool if you have a pre-rigged SMB.


Take it if you need it. But for OW non-penetration tech diving, it's a pretty useless piece of equipment.

 

[b1gcountry]

Does anyone have any experience rigging up an SMB like this? I would be interested to hear the results. My spool always gets unclipped when I have it outside a pocket.

Tom

 

[rjack321]

See, you have just identified the difference between "overhead" and overhead.

"Overhead" -- You're on a non-thirds dive. AKA, you do not have to return to the point you entered the water. You're not running a line, and you don't need a safety spool. Therefore the "don't take it if you don't need it" principle applies. It is just another spool to come untangled in your pocket at an untoward time.

Overhead -- You're on a thirds dive. Cave, wreck pen, or a tech dive where you must return to the point you entered. You're running a line, and you need a separate safety spool if you have a pre-rigged SMB.


Take it if you need it. But for OW non-penetration tech diving, it's a pretty useless piece of equipment.

Since you haven't told me your contingency, just pooed on mine, I'm guessing you don't have a lost buddy protocol for deco dives, non-penetration dives and similar. The most obvious case is people stumbling into wrecks inadventently in marginal vis.

You have until you hit rock bottom to look. What are you going to do just thumb it and leave? Hope to find them on the surface when you finish your deco in 20, 30, 90 mins? How you gonna search, aimlessly?

 

[rjack321]

Back to M's original question -- especially as it applies to DIR-F.

I know the "standard" requires that you assemble and shoot the bag rather than have it pre-rigged, but would the ADA require GUE to permit the use of a pre-rigged bag given M's disability? Would it be a "reasonable accomodation" to permit him to use a pre-rigged bag given that in DIR-F land, the ONLY use for a spool is to shoot a bag?

1) He's got teammates.
2) Its possible to thread the SMB one handed clipping off the bag to the chest while the other hand drops the spool's double-ender through the ring.
3) These are skills, the ADA does not apply (and I don't think Michael is particularly interested in being accomodated either)
4) The point of threading the bag underwater is to help people learn how to do tasks (mid-water) and maintain their SA at the same time. The SMB threading being a fairly straightforward stepping stone to something more complicated like a gas switch.

 

[Bismark]

I have been in Fundamentals classes where the student started with a pre-rigged SMB. Check with your future instructor as to his/her requirements.

 

[rjack321]

just crickets rainman??

 

[seaducer]

Does anyone have any experience rigging up an SMB like this? I would be interested to hear the results. My spool always gets unclipped when I have it outside a pocket.

Tom

I use a similar system, and I haven't had the line unclip since I started rigging it "clip in".
I run the loop out of one hole, back in the next and across the spool and clip it off on the opposite side as tight as possible. The smb clips off on the same ring, but not on the double ender itself.
That is in wide open water only. If I am in tight quarters it goes in a pocket like everything else.