PADI Wreck Specialty

[grazie42]

When I first got interested in wrecktraining (I´d done quite a few dives without training but got enough of a scare on one dive that I figured out that "what I didn´t know, I didn´t know", might actually get me killed) my first step was to look at the PADI wreckdiver specialty.

The course standards didn´t inspire confidence so I asked some friends who´d taken it what it was like. I asked about 5 people who´d taken courses in different places, none of them felt the course had really given them more than two wreckdives and the permission to go out and dive wrecks on their own.

I ended up taking IANTD advanced wreck and adv. recreational trimix (to get to the nicer wrecks), with an instructor who´s been teaching diving longer than I have been alive. I know NAUI has two wreckcourses as well, one "basic" and one advanced, which may make for a smoother progression.

I´ve since taken tech wreck, tmx and cavern. If someone came to me and asked for a "recreational course" to teach them penetration diving, I´d definetly recommend a cavern course.

IANTD has a wreck/cavern combination that would work as well since the standards are the same (except for the diving wrecks part) as their cavern course...

ymmv...

 

[IceBergSlim]

I teach a PADI wreck class that is basicly an intro to local NY/NJ diving. I will not take a student that is not interested in diving cold and somewhat deep. (hardly deep or cold at all but you know).

I find that I can cover the PADI material pretty quickly and move on to more intensive issues. My local wreck scene requires skills and talents beyond the PADI norm and I am pleased I can add them to the course.

Still, there are instructors here that can teach the course verbatim and (I feel) the student learns nothing.

So that was a long way to say you get from the course what your instructors enthusiam and experience put into it.

The PADI wreck course can be quite handy in the right hands and ears.

end 2 cents

 

[Michael Schlink]

Well said and explained Mike. And I can't argue MUCH. However there are those that say-Go find a mentor and learn from them, The PADI wreck course isn't a "real wreck" course and so on so forth. Then I read a thread about divers going INTO what I'll call a clean wreck (intentionally sunk, resort area, cleaned up) And of course there were a lot of different opinions about how safe that was. I think both you and I took the position and I'm being brief "It's an OH so don't go".
I think and(hope) and stress that PADI wreck DOESN"T prepare you to go on penetration dives. I think it shows new wreck divers what they need to do to get to that point. I think it can wet their appetite and they can decide if it's worth going through a "real" wreck course. I think a well taught PADI wreck course can be a perfect INTRODUCTORY wreck course and hopefully show what's involved and what the "dangers" can be so maybe we'll keep a few more divers from going where they aren't supposed to.
I'll admit right here in front of God and country that after taking my cavern course and subsequent cave training, I learned why I shouldn't have been doing some of the things I already had. And I stopped doing them until I completed the needed training. The education and training taught me what NOT to do and I stopped doing it, who knows what would have happened had I not taken the courses I did.

 

[Meister481]

I just took the PADI Wreck Class from a wreck diving nut. He taught quite a bit more than is in the Padi book, he had several books on a reading list he told us would help our understanding of penetrations. He pushed the line work and equipment to the point we were dreaming of our setups at night. We had to handle lines and do turns with our eyes closed to practice silt out. He timed us on our bag deployment as well as proper technique. It was an in depth introduction to penetrations with some tech intro. I feel like I am fully prepared to deal with any problem that could come up. First and foremost, I know to call a dive before it becomes hazardous.

I would recommend his class to anyone not just for his knowledge, but for his continued learning and flexibility. After our last dive we were talking about our bag deployments, I showed him my way and he asked me if he could use it for his classes. That just shows me he's not that "all knowing diving god" Ive been exposed to on every dive boat. I've been exposed to so much that I've begun to see how much I don't know. I feel like that is more important to know your limitations when it comes to this type of diving.

 

[billyh]

Having just completed the PADI Wreck course, I can offer the following:
Your training experience is completely dependent on your instructor and your location. 75fsw in Florida or Carribbean is very different from 90-120fsw in the Atlantic. Wetsuits and aluminum 80's are very different from drysuits and double steel 100's. I know we tend to rely on the maxim Your Mileage May Vary, but there is a LOT of variation in the equation to consider.

The PADI course is an excellent "appetizer", intended to allow a flavor of the pursuit. If one wanted to take things further, they might have the common sense to pay close attention to the more experienced divers they will meet on their 4 qualifying dives. The new wreck enthusiast might also realize that they are at least 50 dives away from actually being able to say they know anything "certain" about their new pursuit. I think PADI would do better to emphasize the reality that their program is the bare beginning to a learning and experience-building process that your very life may well depend on someday.

Unfortunately, our secular consumerist, fast-food, fast-culture, quasi-humanist society is obsessed with short cuts and consumer efficiency. "Easy" certifications are good for the diving industry in general, and most participants will get what they are after-- in this example bragging rights at the bar or family reunion. It is so easy to slip into the water, grab that downline, and head for the hook. Has the newly-minted Wreck Specialist truly, eidetically visualized what could go wrong and what their near-automatic response should be? Have they been drilled in that response? Have they practiced that response in a variety of contexts? The PADI courseware covers not one bit of the emergency preparedness the advancing intermediate diver needs.

A good instructor (I had one) will go WAY beyond the specific curriculum of the PADI course outline. A really good instructor (mine again) lives and breathes this stuff, and practices the specialty on a regular basis. Great instructors have been diving wrecks for 30 - 40 years (mine again!) and can share invaluable insights into the individual wreck you may be visiting, in addition to helping you sort out your (new) gear requirements and setup.

A good Captain won't let you dive from his boat unless you can prove you know what you are up to. A typical base requirement (in my part of the world) might read like this: ". . . For all dives over 90 feet in depth divers must produce a log book showing evidence of at least five (5) dives in the northeastern United States (or equivalent location) to depths between 60 and 80 feet within the last 12 months. The only exception to this rule is an instructor diving with a student." So you could have your AOW, and your Wreck card, and still not necessarily be allowed to dive from an "experienced" boat. Think about it. It is not that the new diver or PADI is wrong, it is that the Captain is always right. The dive charter captain may care more about your safety and life than even your instructor, and certainly cares more than PADI.

I had a ball doing my training, learned way more than I thought I would, and also learned I am actually just beginning to climb up the learning curve, despite having my "official" PADI Wreck card in hand. I've caught the "bug", and can't wait to get back out there and dive more wrecks. I may be hiring my instructor "ex officio" to get more guidance and experience under my belt while building my numbers and experience. My choice -- I can afford it, and it feels like the right thing to do.

And, I'm doing four days of DIR-F next week to better hone my skills and situational awareness underwater. Like I said, this is the bare beginning of the learning curve. I have a long, long way to go!

Ahhh. . . but this

 

[Bluto]

The problem I had with the PADI course was that it is specifically not intended to teach wreck penetration. Not considered 'recreational' diving. At some point you will have to go to a tech shop, not only for training but also equipment. Find an insrtuctor you like and respect and the rest is just time and money. A lot of both.

 

[Kevrumbo]

Use this outline as a standard to see if the Wreck Course is rigorous enough to match your current ability and satisfy future wreck diving goals (otherwise the PADI course, depending on the Instructor, may be just fine. . .):
http://www.5thd-x.com/classes/outlines/wreck1.html

 

[aue-mike]

Use this outline as a standard to see if the Wreck Course is rigorous enough to match your current ability and satisfy future wreck diving goals (otherwise the PADI course, depending on the Instructor, may be just fine. . .):
http://www.5thd-x.com/classes/outlines/wreck1.html

Sorry, just as with the PADI course, too little information is offered on REAL wreck diving issues, such as shipwreck identification, mapping, nautical architecture, navigation and orientation, etc.
It is too focused on gear and techniques, information and skills which frankly should be acquired during basic diver education.
Reading over the 5th D outline and remove the word "wreck" from it and you would have just a basic diving course -- absolutely NOTHING specific to shipwreck diving IMHO.

Topics include:

• Working knowledge (including setup and failures) of doubles tank configuration

• Extensive practice/use and failure of guidelines and protocols

• The history and practice of minimum decompression

• Physics, physiology, tables and operational considerations.

I really don't see much specific or additional benefit.

 

[Kevrumbo]

Good report write-up on the 5thd-x NAUI Wreck Class:
http://www.scubaboard.com/showthread.php?t=120774
Flow chart of Courses and comparable courses from other Agencies:
http://www.breakthrudiving.com/classes/indexclass.html
Video from the inaugural Class:
http://www.breakthrudiving.com/classes/roadshow/06videogallery.htm

Sorry, just as with the PADI course, too little information is offered on REAL wreck diving issues, such as shipwreck identification, mapping, nautical architecture, navigation and orientation, etc.
It is too focused on gear and techniques, information and skills which frankly should be acquired during basic diver education.
Reading over the 5th D outline and remove the word "wreck" from it and you would have just a basic diving course -- absolutely NOTHING specific to shipwreck diving IMHO. I really don't see much specific or additional benefit.

What specific benefit is it that you don't see, aue-mike?
Pray tell, how would you teach a REAL Wreck Class?

 

[aue-mike]

Good report write-up on the 5thd-x NAUI Wreck Class:
http://www.scubaboard.com/showthread.php?t=120774
Flow chart of Courses and comparable courses from other Agencies:
http://www.breakthrudiving.com/classes/indexclass.html
Video from the inaugural Class:
http://www.breakthrudiving.com/classes/roadshow/06videogallery.htm

What specific benefit is it that you don't see, aue-mike?
Pray tell, how would you teach a REAL Wreck Class?

Those links are all well and good, and again simply echo my comments. It would appear most of the training is on gear, and is basically the same as to what you would get in a cavern course (but with doubles standard and liftbags I suppose, whoopity-doo).

As I mentioned in my previous post, but will repeat here for slow learners, it would be beneficial to include more wreck-specific information -- you know, information specific to shipwrecks. Yes, penetration skills are part of it, but for people that want to know about shipwrecks and wreck diving, I don't think you necessarily need to know about doubles (including setup and failures), minimum decompression, and physics/physiology. Again, that could be learned in other tech courses.

For someone that wants to know what they are actually looking at on the bottom and learn something about shipwrecks, it offers little IMHO. And its not specific to 5th D, so don't get your panties all twisted. The same thing goes from classes I see offered by PADI, etc.

Pray tell, how would you teach a REAL Wreck Class?

As I stated in my first post, but will repeat here for slow learners, issues such as shipwreck identification, mapping, nautical architecture, navigation and orientation should be discussed, as well as the standard use of guidelines, shooting bags, rigging issues, penetration considerations, etc., that most courses offer. Also, where you can research shipwrecks, sources of information, etc. I just think it is more than running lines, but learning about shipwrecks themselves. It is beneficial to know basic vessel layout, differences in powerplants, noticing diagnostic features that can help you date a vessel or orient yourself on a shipwreck, etc. For example, being able to notice a hawse pipe and chain locker in the debris field of a broken down wreck will quickly tell you that you are on the remains of the bow versus the stern. Or the fact that boilers are placed forward of triple expansion engines so you know which way you might be swimming on a broken down freighter, etc. Not all wrecks are intact artificial reefs like the YUKON.

Plus many other tricks and tips that no one teaches, and you get only after having been diving on a wide range of shipwrecks for a number of years (not from a generic textbook or video like PADI, etc.).

If you want to simply safely dive on wrecks, take any of the agency offered courses. If you want to be a wreck diver and learn about shipwrecks, you need to know much more....