PADI tables finally going away?

[DiveNav]

which specific one .....

All the ones that the dive shop sells ?

.......and how to have it do the dives in the class ...

Online ?

Alberto

 

[rstofer]

PADI also discourages students under "master diver" level from diving without an instructor present.

Where does this come from? Is this written down someplace?

I'll admit to having only taken a couple of PADI specialties but I have never heard of such a thing.

Richard

 

[Kaliber35]

If you look at point #2 in 330Bar's list, you can see who is assigned the task of thinking. PADI also discourages students under "master diver" level from diving without an instructor present. So, I'm guessing that "officially" PADI diver-buddy independence is intended to be a core skill for the very few. Other agencies teach a higher degree of self-reliance earlier on. This thread seems to be split between those who are fine with dive instruction's drift towards passport diving and those who are lamenting or even fighting the erosion of rigor and self-reliance. I took both NAUI and PADI basic open water. I started diving by paying instructors for instruction and diving with only my buddy, never changed. I started this shortly after both OW classes and have a couple of really bad dives in my log to prove it. Whose fault would that be? Anything that stresses personal skills resonates with me because, twice proven, that is what keeps me alive. However, I'm also sensitive to those who just want to have a fun dive, look at stuff, and hang out with other divers. That's just fine with me, no judgement, just different interests. How are they best served? I dive with two computers, one that I know inside and out, and one that I need to learn a hell of a lot better so that it will help get me back from where I'm now headed. In addition, I carry turn pressures and OH S***! highly abbreviated air 'tables' cut at 5 worst-case depths and the limits of my gas load for the planned dive. Anything past that is unfortunately, purely theoretical. All divers are not alike, one style of instruction does not fit all.

:bonk::crazyeye::loopy: One small point at a time. Overload of

All divers are not alike, one style of instruction does not fit all.

Thats why we have experience and organizations. Everyone, IMO, needs the core basics. Then, if you want something more in your training then its up to you to seek it out. I think NAUI and PADI do a great job at offering as much as they can in a 1101 class. Dont you?

 

[lowviz]

................ I think NAUI and PADI do a great job at offering as much as they can in a 1101 class. Dont you?

Yes.




rstofer:
That came from my old instructor. Point taken, I'll share what PADI has to say about it when they respond.

 

[deco_martini]

There it is...the answer to stop this argument lol.

Teach BOTH!

Now let's pen an email and send it to all of the agencies and get the ball rolling )

Do we really need to teach people how to dive a computer? I got a 5 minute talk on how to use mine when I bought it. That was pretty much all that was necessary.

 

[Peter Guy]

Point taken, I'll share what PADI has to say about it when they respond.

When who responds? As far as I know, PADI has, at the very least, an informal policy of NOT responding to these boards -- call PADI and ask if you want the answer.

OR, read on.

Again, as far as I know, the "official" PADI answer is that once certified as an Open Water Diver, you have been "certified" to independently dive under "better, same or similar conditions" as you were trained. For the Open Water Diver, that means no more than 60 feet for example -- but it does mean "independently" of a "professional."

As a practical matter, I think most instructors suggest new divers to dive with more experienced divers while they gain the practical experience needed to become truly independent. But this advice is given, or should be given, to everyone as they progress (I know I like to dive with more experienced Full Cave divers and I'm Full Cave -- but I'm a newbie Full Cave diver -- same with staged deco dives).

BUT, there is nothing within the PADI system that says an OW Certified diver "must dive" with a dive professional -- it just might be wise some times.

 

[Elonna]

Do we really need to teach people how to dive a computer? I got a 5 minute talk on how to use mine when I bought it. That was pretty much all that was necessary.

How experienced of a diver were you when you started to use one? I have 7 dives under my belt... including my discover scuba and OW cert dives and have never seen a computer at work. Would I feel comfortable strapping one on my wrist and relying only on that with 5 minutes of training in it's use? No. Maybe I'm overly conservative. I don't mind that. However, I'd probably feel more comfortable with doing something like that had I had some very basic PDC training in my OW class. At least I'd know basically how to read it and what things were. Even with a PDC, I'd probably plan my dives using tables...at least in the beginning.

 

[HowardE]

How experienced of a diver were you when you started to use one? I have 7 dives under my belt... including my discover scuba and OW cert dives and have never seen a computer at work. Would I feel comfortable strapping one on my wrist and relying only on that with 5 minutes of training in it's use? No. Maybe I'm overly conservative. I don't mind that. However, I'd probably feel more comfortable with doing something like that had I had some very basic PDC training in my OW class. At least I'd know basically how to read it and what things were. Even with a PDC, I'd probably plan my dives using tables...at least in the beginning.

The first piece of Scuba gear (other than mask and fins) that I bought was a PDC. I had about 8 dives. The instruction manual for the computer was simple enough to understand the basic functions of the computer.

Even knowing nothing about computers at that point, (since I learned how to dive using tables) - it was quite intuitive as to how to go. The computer displayed depth and NDL time remaining. No adjustments were required on the computer for diving air, and it automatically started doing a 3 minute countdown once I broke 20 feet on the way up. You didn't even have to turn it on, as most are wet activated.

So I would say that with absolutely no training in how to use a PDC, you'd be able to complete an air NDL dive with one. 99.9% of new divers can't even stay down long enough to even reach their NDL (you catch my drift?)

 

[lowviz]

When who responds? As far as I know, PADI has, at the very least, an informal policy of NOT responding to these boards -- call PADI and ask if you want the answer.

I emailed PADI directly and asked at what PADI cert. level they would endorse unrestricted diving within recreational limits without an instructor present. We shall see. Oh well, that's what I get for posting 'looser' than my norm...

 

[deco_martini]

How experienced of a diver were you when you started to use one? I have 7 dives under my belt... including my discover scuba and OW cert dives and have never seen a computer at work. Would I feel comfortable strapping one on my wrist and relying only on that with 5 minutes of training in it's use? No.

Feeling uncomfortable with change and the unknown is natural.