PADI tables finally going away?

[jgros79]

I've never seen a diver in over 10 years of diving use a table for diving unless its their OW class and I'm coming across more and more new divers who don't know how to read their own computer or the rental computer.
I think it's time for PADI to reduce the info on tables in the OW book and take out students having to actually learn the table. Leave a page to cover the theory and basic physics so people will understand what it was used for and then cover computer usage alot more.
Divers who dive with computers has drastically increased over the past four years so why not adapt to modern times? What do you think?

 

[Blackwood]

What do you think?

 

[UCFKnightDiver]

I use tables at times, as well as the computer between my ears, what happens when your computer fails or gives you wrong information? If you dont have an idea of what the times at certain depths etc should be you could be in for a world of hurt. Many many technical divers use tables over computers for this reason. A computer is simply not needed. Therefore in my opinion knowing how to read tables is a very beneficial skill to have.

 

[rstofer]

I think they should NEVER discuss computers, drop the eRDP and eRDP ML and spend 3 or 4 nights discussing the dive tables. The only decent information available on the effects of depth/time/SIT are in the tables.

The eRDP doesn't even provide RNT. How can anyone even think about a dive without knowing how long they have been at each depth before they even get there? Knowing the adjusted NDL just doesn't convey the same information.

Computer: well, they all have a PLAN feature so you know how long you can stay at each depth based on your current status. That's a good feature. The problem is, they are too darn complex. One button models are very difficult to use but easier than 2 button computers. The 3 button computer is probably the easiest to use. In any event, reading the User Manual is like reading stereo instructions. They are written by technical writers who have never spent an instant in open water. Nobody I know understands how to fully use their computer (including me) and, lacking such expertise, somehow feel like they can just trust the display (which they probably don't understand either). Further, unless it is the LiquiVision X1, the things are just too hard to read.

Write your adjusted NDLs on a slate and use your depth gauge and timer. Nothing could be simpler and, arguably, safer.

At the moment, there is no way to get the PADI Nitrox certificate without some proficiency with tables. I don't know if the eLearning course has changed that but the book based course is all about tables.

Richard

 

[*dave*]

I'm wondering who will pay for these computers. Should we require students show up with a computer as part of their BOW gear? Jack the BOW price up to cover the difference between issuing tables and issuing a computer? Putting 10 computers into the rental fleet would strain most LDS budgets at a point where many are already struggling.

I think they should NEVER discuss computers, drop the eRDP and eRDP ML and spend 3 or 4 nights discussing the dive tables.

Three or four nights on the tables? They can be easily explained and understood in less than an hour by a competent instructor. Besides, three or four nights exceeds the length of many certification courses these days.

 

[The Chairman]

Tables will make a nice footnote in the history of diving, but they are obviously not being utilized by the diving public at this point. It's time to for the agencies still holding on to the facade to stop deceiving themselves that inflicting tables on students gives them a better idea about on-gassing/off-gassing physiology. It's easy enough to see your gas loading on any modern dive computer and then to see the load decrease during your surface interval.

Teaching them how to use the GEAR that they will actually be using only makes sense, which is probably why some oppose it! Too many divers have no idea what to do when their alarm goes off or how to track their dives since NO ONE HAS TAUGHT THEM. That's the real travesty: we refuse to teach these important skills.

Tables should be reserved for those who WANT to learn them as an add on or even as a specialty. Yes, you will need them if you ever get into tech diving, but very few go that route. As for the lame argument about what to do if your computer fails... well, you will need to do the same thing as when your SPG fails or if your reg free flows: end the dive! You're bound to find a rental at most dive resorts/charters.

 

[The Chairman]

I'm wondering who will pay for these computers.

All of my student regs have an Oceanic Veo250 attached. They are easy and intuitive for students to use and master.

 

[Matt S.]

The tables should be taught because even if you fly a computer, it can crap out. Knowing the tables could save your dive vacation.

But I think use of computers should also be taught. People who get out of OW class knowing tables but not computers can buy a nice computer and make some bad mistakes with it.

- Believing the computer senses ACTUAL nitrogen accumulation instead of modeling it
- Disregarding or misunderstanding the computer's instructions, like ascent alarms
- Believing that following the computer's advice makes them awesome deco divers
- Crazy stuff like alternating computers for more bottom time (Yes! Saw that story on another thread. OMG.)

You can't teach how to operate every computer, but they all work the same way, mathematically modeling nitrogen loading. Understanding that will improve diver safety. More understanding always does.

 

[*dave*]

All of my student regs have an Oceanic Veo250 attached. They are easy and intuitive for students to use and master.

I'm sure they are.....

We have about 20 rental rigs and have seen weekends when every single rig was out on checkouts. If we were to do away with the tables, each of these rigs would need a computer for a total of 20 computers. The only practical way to teach computers is for them all to be identical in operation, so 20 computers at even $200/each would amount to a substantial expense.

Then there's a potential liability issue, I would guess: "I got bent using your computer" . I have chapter answers and test results on file I can use to prove a student knew the tables, but not sure how we'd cover ourselves on computer instruction.

 

[Randy43068]

I've never seen a diver in over 10 years of diving use a table for diving unless its their OW class and I'm coming across more and more new divers who don't know how to read their own computer or the rental computer.
I think it's time for PADI to reduce the info on tables in the OW book and take out students having to actually learn the table. Leave a page to cover the theory and basic physics so people will understand what it was used for and then cover computer usage alot more.
Divers who dive with computers has drastically increased over the past four years so why not adapt to modern times? What do you think?

you must not dive much outside of your area..??

I use tables for rec dives. I carry NAUI tables in my drysuit pocket and know many divers who don't use a computer at all.