New vs. Used?

[ScubaFreak]

How does that warranty make it any better a "lifeline"?

I retired my new reg (Mk20/G500) and have gone to some used regs (Mk10/BA) I picked up on ebay. They perform every bit as well and promise to be more durable. I've never understood how that warrenty was going to do much good while submerged.

I didn't say the warranty made it a better lifeline, i pointed out that for such an important piece of equipment, i'd prefer to have a warranty should something happen (touch wood).
At least with a new reg, i know it's history, but even with a second hand one, service history or not, I wouldn't be comfortable with it.
Sorry if it didn't come across that way.

 

[Mo2vation]

I don't get this.

A drysuit is a bag with a zipper. My first DS was bought off of eBay. My next one wasn't because I got the deal of the decade. I'd buy a used drysuit way before I'd buy used regs, or a used BC.

That said, 99.9% of my gear has come off of eBay. My regs, wifie's regs, my BP/W, fins, lights, compasses, computers, bags, blah, blah. All without a single issue.

Drysuits are cheap to fix (presuming the zipper is working.) Seal replacement is simple, patching is even easier. I don't get the hesitation. If the seller if your size (hee hee...or was your size) what's the deal? They're much easier to repair than a BC.

As to regs - please. I'd buy a used one off of eBay in a moment, if the price was right. Re-build kits are cheap, and you're not paying the inflated retail prices or the consumer acquisition expenses of the manufacturer or dealer...or for that matter, the pretty box. Factory Warranties on these things are overrated, especially seeing as you take them in every year to get checked and serviced anyway. DA is right on the money - good condition, recent model regs are one of the treasures of eBay.


Scubafreak - I get your point... the whole "peace of mind" thing. And I'm a nut about caring for my gear. But I tell you what, I've dropped my regs a number of times. I'd stepped on the hose, and bounced the first stage... and they breathe great and perform perfectly 6 years later. The minute someone opens it up and screws it on, its used. And most of that used eBay stuff (when carefully selected) will be much less used and abused than my own gear. Buy it, get it checked, bring it up to performance levels, and save some cash.


---
Ken

 

[DA Aquamaster]

I didn't say the warranty made it a better lifeline, i pointed out that for such an important piece of equipment, i'd prefer to have a warranty should something happen (touch wood).
At least with a new reg, i know it's history, but even with a second hand one, service history or not, I wouldn't be comfortable with it.
Sorry if it didn't come across that way.

I have to go with AWAP and mo2vation on this again. A good regulator is perhaps the ultimate in "durable goods" and they will literally last decades with anything approaching reasonable care. I am admittedly also a bit of throw back and am a fan of chrome plated brass second stages. They don't give you dry mouth, the heat tranfers traits make them ideal for cold water and if they are dropped or banged around they won't crack and decide to suddenly leak on you at depth like a graphite/plastic/resin cased second stage will. And they still look nice after 20 years as opposed to about 20 dives for a plastic cased second stage.

So given a choice, I'd take a Mk 10 Balanced Adjustable over a Mk 25 G500 or Mk 25 S600 any day. And the difference in price between a used MK 10 BA in excellent condition and a new Mk 25 S600 is going to come to about $400 even if you pay for a fresh annual service on the Mk 10 BA.

The $400 you save will just about pay for a new BC or BP/wing and there is, in my opinion, a lot more that can go wrong and be difficult, expensive or impossible to fix on a used BC than on a used regulator.

 

[WarmWaterDiver]

Like DA, I've had great success with buying pre-owned regulators - first and second stages. There's a difference between warranty and 'free parts for life' especially if something warrants a recall. This is whether 20 years older model or 2 years older model. My current favorite setup, a Scubapro MK25 with D400, is something I don't think you could get brand new (seemed like the D400 wasn't available new about the time the MK25 was sold new in place of the MK20, but I'll defer to any corrections by DA). Also, all the 'bugs' of the design and that particular setup have much better chance of being resolved. A current example is the Scubapro X650 - I'm not looking to buy one of those whether new or pre-owned. Making sure the manufacturer still supports service parts supply is something to always consider with used regulators - one reason I have come to prefer Scubapro regulators personally.

I've also had some success with buying pre-owned other dive equipment, but it's more mixed. For example, there's a limited market for either new or used XS stuff, so I've found some incredible bargains for my petite wife. But, most of all, I did my best to research what it was I was interested in before buying - whether new or used, dive equipment, vehicles, etc. With the Internet these days, that's more easily done than ever before. And, good communication with the seller is a strong point too, before, during, and after the deal is struck until full exchange of goods and monies are completed. If the equipment and price look good but the seller has poor communication, I'm more apt to pass until the next deal I see comes along.

 

[DA Aquamaster]

The Mk 25 and D400 production overlapped for a short time and the Mk 25 D400 was a catalog item until the 2004 catalog where it was discontinued in favor of the the anticipated but not yet available X650. While the X650 was finally available around December 2004, it was soon recalled and SP has yet to produce any significant numbers of them.

Being an SP tech and a D400 fan who is a little miffed at the replacement of what I felt was SP's best second stage, I just have to try an X650. However this has been difficult as my X650 has been on backorder since August. SP used to allow regs filling the same market niche to overlap for 2-3 years to ensure the replacement was well received but they chose not to do that with the D400/X650. In this case, SP could have been selling D400's to happy customers instead of shooting their reputation in the foot with the not yet ready for market X650. Really bad move on their part.

The Mk 10 D400, Mk 15 D400, and Mk 20 D400 are all very common and are usually good deals on E-bay going for around $100-$125 for a Mk 10 D400 to $175 for a Mk 20 D400.

Mk 15's are less common and had a shorter production span than either the Mk 10 or Mk 20 and they are somtimes sleepers on e-bay offerring Mk 20 performance at Mk 10 prices.

 

[ScubaFreak]

Oh well, i supose like all gear, it's a matter of personal opinion

 

[turnerjd]

As ScubaFreak says its all a matter of personal opinion.

I had a quick look on ebay.co.uk for drysuits, and looking at the prices asked (for suits that would seem to be in good condition) and the fact you might not get one that is a good fit why don't you try getting a basic suit new? New RoHo Quatro suits made to measure with valves and undersuit can be bought for £389 (or a bit more if you want a thinsulate).

As for a BCD... secondhand is good.

Have you also asked your LDS what they do with BCDs and Drysuits after a couple of years? most LDSs will happily sell ex-rental stock to there more loyal customers.

Look in the back of Diver magasine - there are often adverts during the winter months for the sale of ex-rental kit.

HTH

JonT

 

[DA Aquamaster]

Used rental gear is an excellent option as it will be in good condition, is usually freshly serviced and in most cases the LDS will be able to service it into the distant future (but not always as dropping a dealership will entail switching the rentals as well).

This makes a great option for the just certified diver and our LDS will take the items purchased used back in on trade when you upgrade to something new.

Used drysuits on E-bay can be an excellent deal but it will take you a while to find that deal. If you are in a hurry, it probably is not the way to go. Size also matters as some suit sizes are more saleable than others and will attract a lot more bidders. Oddities in size also help. For example, the last suit I bought was an XXL with size 9 boots, which is an odd combination as 12-14 is more the norm. Consequently, I had the only bid on an excellent suit with one dive on it. Even with the cost of installing new boots the cost of the suit is still under $400.