New Shearwater AI transmitter - the Swift

[stuartv]

Is this a standard MH8A transmitter, ie will it function with other brand computers?

Yes.

had it been Suunto - even with the same customer service, the trolling would have been epic

Maybe. Maybe not. We can't know, since Suunto doesn't provide that kind of customer service.

That said, I agree with you that the PPS transmitters are awful. The only benefit to them is that several dive computer brands will talk to a PPS tx. They lack in every other area compared to other transmitters. Luckily, Shearwater has made their own so Shearwater owners don't have to live with PPS anymore. PPS was a reasonable option at the time. They needed to get AI into their products without a long development cycle. Just because your DC has a radio on a particular frequency doesn't mean you can't implement additional protocols in software for improvements.

Once the price comes down to earth, I think they'll see some strong adoption. Most transmitters are in the mid $200 range, and are often included free during sales with a dive computer purchase. These are better than PPS, but they don't seem to offer any features not found on competing transmitters like Scubapro, Suunto, and Ratio.

Why are PPS transmitters awful? By and large, they are very easy to use, last a VERY long time on a battery, and are very reliable. Does not having LEDs on them make them awful?

MY jury is out on the Swift as far as their guts go. They have the same FCC ID as the PPS transmitters. Until somebody shows me some kind of proof otherwise, I'm going to assume that the actual chip(s) inside that talk to the receiver in your computer are still chips from PPS. I'm guessing they just added something on to the board where the PPS chip(s) lives that delays the PPS chip from transmitting until it detects a clear channel.

And even on that, I'd like to know more. If two transmitters both listen for interference at the same time and then transmit at exactly the same time, will their "collision avoidance" really prevent that? Or does the collision avoidance just prevent transmissions that would overlap, as long as they don't start at exactly the same time?

Last, where are you seeing other transmitters for $200? I only see Suunto, ScubaPro, and Garmin transmitters for about $400. The Ratio transmitter is $379.

 

[tridacna]

Yes.
Last, where are you seeing other transmitters for $200? I only see Suunto, ScubaPro, and Garmin transmitters for about $400. The Ratio transmitter is $379.

...and trust me, not many stores are giving them away as part of a "computer deal".

 

[Bigbella]

Yup, it’s Huish. Doesn’t make it any better for me. It’s just plain horrible.

Suunto Oy's presence in the US was always a drag, even in the early 1990s -- well pre-Huish -- when they were distributed by SeaQuest; and their Solution computer was, then, quite popular -- still possess a couple that see use. They made Poseidon seem like the "Welcome Wagon;" and their US distributor, at the time, was an absolute nightmare.

Any and all repairs were to be completed in Helsinki (for a long while, not even computer batteries were allowed to be replaced by local dive shops; had to be mailed-out; and Suunto, at the time, went so far as to bury the four access screws, under some odd red sealant -- as though, heh, heh, it would ever stop us); communication was absolutely nil; and it was weeks to months, before a faulty or repaired item was ever returned; or, more commonly, quietly replaced, without further comment.

This criticism comes from someone who has had their products, for decades -- a seeming outlier, who has not had any issue with either faulty depth sensors (everything currently jibes with my beloved analogue gauges); who only had to deal with them, on the behalf of others; nor was I ever involved, in any capacity, with that class-action suit, of a few years back . . .

 

[Diving Dubai]

Maybe. Maybe not. We can't know, since Suunto doesn't provide that kind of customer service.

I can only speak from experience. I had a pressure sensor failure out of warranty on my Eon. I contacted Helsinki. I had an afternoon of email exchange - they overnighted a new sensor to Dubai and it was replaced 2 days later FOC.

I also had 12 transmitters changed over 18 months FOC. Because of poor battery performance. There was a thought it was due to the temps here causing issues. The actual cause was the (ex) local distributor using counterfeit batteries

 

[Diving Dubai]

Historical issues? The class action was in 2018. I think 2028 is a more reasonable timeframe for folks to forgive and forget... assuming they get their act together.

A USA only class action from ambulance chasers after a quick buck No where else had a suit

Pressure Sensor failures are obvious - I’ve had one.

Stuff fails - I can’t get excited about it.

My F150 has been THE most unreliable vehicle I’ve ever owned- I’d still consider buying another though

 

[lexvil]

A USA only class action from ambulance chasers after a quick buck No where else had a suit

Pressure Sensor failures are obvious - I’ve had one.

Stuff fails - I can’t get excited about it.

My F150 has been THE most unreliable vehicle I’ve ever owned- I’d still consider buying another though

Ambulance chasing in and of itself won’t make anyone a buck, stuff fails and responsible companies respond quickly to provide a solution companies who loose to the ambulance chasers are, more often than not, responsible for their own problems.

 

[kelemvor]

Exactly. According to the articles about the situation that I read, most or all of the class members first tried to get Suunto to fix the failed computers. Suunto denied there was a problem until people hired a lawyer and sued, now they get to live with being a scuba pariah for a while.

A USA only class action from ambulance chasers after a quick buck No where else had a suit

What do you want people to do, take it up in the Hague? The people that were pissed enough about being screwed were Americans so they took the issue to an American court. The products are generally $1000 or less so it's going to cost more to sue than you'll get back in damages. That means only people suing out of general principal would take it that far.

For example, you said you got screwed with a faulty transducer and didn't sue (yet).

 

[broncobowsher]

And Shearwater will have a loaner to you in a day or so, repair completed and back in a week or two.
Thus the cult like following of Shearwater. When something goes wrong, it is taken care of, not ignored. Hardware or software. We are on V84 of the software now I believe. They listen to the customer and make changes. There will likely be a V85 soon. And they are free upgrades. Unlike some other brands that will charge you money to put the latest software on. At least some used to do that.

 

[ATJ]

That said, I agree with you that the PPS transmitters are awful. The only benefit to them is that several dive computer brands will talk to a PPS tx. They lack in every other area compared to other transmitters. Luckily, Shearwater has made their own so Shearwater owners don't have to live with PPS anymore. PPS was a reasonable option at the time. They needed to get AI into their products without a long development cycle. Just because your DC has a radio on a particular frequency doesn't mean you can't implement additional protocols in software for improvements.

I, too, want to know why you think the PPS transmitters are awful!

I have three Oceanic branded transmitters, all bought 2nd hand, and they all work perfectly. They batteries last way longer than what the specs say.

It what way do they lack?

 

[kelemvor]

They've got the problem where they conflict with each other when multiples are in use. Scubapro supports 8 with no special anything. Ratio supports 10 at a time. In both cases there's no special green or yellow or whatever. You just use up to 8 or 10 of the appropriate brand transmitter. A tech diver could concievably use one of these computers and have pressure data for every single bottle he brought for the dive. Not that a tech diver should be using a Scubapro (for other reasons) but as far as transmitters go, Scubapro is good. Ratio is a solid tech computer, although there are things I dislike about it.

The fact that the PPS transmitter transmits when pressurized regardless of change in pressure. I.e. when you put your reg on a tank, test everything, and sit down for an hour long boat ride. With other brands you don't have to turn things back off in order to conserve battery.

I think there's something hokey about the pairing system with PPS as well but I can't remember and don't want to look it up at the moment. I'm sure users of PPS transmitters are used to it. With scubapro or ratio, you pair the tx when you buy it. You could also connect them to other computers simultaneously (i.e. for buddy or sidemount doubles). Once and done. Forever. Even if you change batteries on the computer and the transmitter. All you do to pair the transmitter is touch the computer to the transmitter for a few seconds. The computer will pop up with a "do you want to pair to this tx" type screen on its own.

Now, for a long time I did have battery life issues with my scubapro transmitters. That turned out to be a tech at my local shop putting the wrong battery in there. Once I started doing it myself, things went well. Not sure if that's Scubapro's fault with their documentation or the shop guy. I haven't had a low battery warning since I started doing it myself but I still replace the battery every couple years out of an abundance of caution.

I'm not sure when Ratio released their transmitters but the scubapro was released around 2005, so it's not exactly cutting edge newness.

That's why I think PPS Sucks compared to the other options, and why I think it's so great that Shearwater rolled their own.