My *new* old Scubapro 109

[NotSure]

And that is possible. I had a bit of a heavy hand removing the lever originally and may well have bent it, though to me it looks good.

I doubt you could bend the feet by removing the lever and I agree that it looks fine in the photo. Installing an S-wing poppet in a 109 is more difficult some times than it is in a G250. Just make sure that the poppet is aligned correctly. Don't assume that if it is working that the the poppet alignment is correct because they will work half ass even with the poppet incorrectly installed. Get a flashlight and look down the barrel because they often get rotated when the lever is installed.

 

[halocline]

It must have been the angle of the photo because your poppet does appear to be correct. The seat still looks a little strange to me but I doubt that is your issue. I have never had the lever you picture not work on a BA, but it is possibe that the feet are bent incorrectly.

The seat is fine, the hole is what allows for air to get to the balance chamber. Only the unbalanced poppets lack the hole in the seat. I've never seen a red one, though.

The feet are almost certainly not bent out of shape, it takes a special tool to do that. Between my earlier post on this thread and the older threads on lever/poppet compatibility, I believe the relevant information is there to get this reg working perfectly. I have replaced a few 109 levers with the newer model when converting to balanced; it works so well I would probably just do it as a matter of course if I were to buy any more 109s and convert them. The curved feet seems to make the whole thing operate more smoothly.

 

[uncfnp]

I'm convinced. I need all the help I can get. New lever ordered and I will be extra cautious of the rotation when reinstalling the poppet. Expected deliver of the lever isn't for a few weeks so I will continue with my plan to reassemble tomorrow and adjust it per halocline, then do it again when the new lever arrives.

 

[Couv]

Please post a picture of the poppet, balance chamber, and spring the way you have them arranged in the air barrel.

Edit: If you have not done so already, go to Home - Vintage Double Hose --> Manuals & Catalogs--> ScubaPro schematics --> download the file named "ScubaPro poppet changes." Have a look at the very last photo in that file. Your poppet installation should look like the one pictured there. I.e. orifice-poppet assembly-spring-balance chamber-adjustment knob.

You may have mentioned this already, but did you also replace the old 109 (heavy) spring with the new lighter spring when you did the conversion?

 

[halocline]

That VDH article is a nice write up with excellent cutaway photos, Couv. Were you responsible for that?

 

[Bryan@Vintage Double Hose]

That VDH article is a nice write up with excellent cutaway photos, Couv. Were you responsible for that?

He and I worked on it together....I had the cutaways setting around for a long time and finally decided something should be done with them as they are such a great visual tool to learn from. I took some pictures and did the outline and Couv came in, filled in the blanks and corrected my errors.
I recently uploaded the operating principals of the 109 style 2nd stage to the Scubapro section. Its a must read in my opinion.

 

[uncfnp]

Please post a picture of the poppet, balance chamber, and spring the way you have them arranged in the air barrel.

Edit: If you have not done so already, go to Home - Vintage Double Hose --> Manuals & Catalogs--> ScubaPro schematics --> download the file named "ScubaPro poppet changes." Have a look at the very last photo in that file. Your poppet installation should look like the one pictured there. I.e. orifice-poppet assembly-spring-balance chamber-adjustment knob.

You may have mentioned this already, but did you also replace the old 109 (heavy) spring with the new lighter spring when you did the conversion?

Yes. The new spring came with the kit.

 

[Couv]

Well, I was hoping for an easy one. :-( The alignment in your picture looks correct-I guess we'll have to wait on the new lever. In the meantime, and now that you have everything removed from the air barrel, shine a good light down it and check for any debris, etc. that may be causing the the poppet to bind up.

 

[uncfnp]

Thanks couv. I can't tell you guys how much I appreciate the help.

I did look down the barrel. Looked clean. Relubed the rings and reinstalled the parts. Spent much of the day and most of the gas in a small pony tank just playing with it, making small adjustments and following halocline's suggestion. Got it just past freeflow, put on the cover and it freeflowed. Frustrating. I know it's my lack of experience but I will get there.

I'm going to take a break while I wait on the lever and read Harlow again. Now that I have opened one up and played around with it some, I think it will make more sense. I also have an S600 that needs attention. I can start cleaning and inspecting it and that might give me a better understanding of these seconds but I don't want to move onto a first stage until I have a better grip on the seconds.

 

[redacted]

Got it just past freeflow, put on the cover and it freeflowed.

To me, that is a good sign as long as it takes just a small adjustment after the cover is installed. That way you know the lever is not too low.