This is a post I placed on another char board I thought I would copy it here because it is the right thing to do. The topic is regarding the Intro diver and single cylinders.
Kudos to Ginnie Springs Staff,
The staff at Ginnie have done nothing wrong in telling Intro-to-cave divers that they cannot use doubles unless they are in possession of a signed waiver by their instructor.
Ginnie is not a facility that is public, they are private and as such they have the right to impose any restriction they deem necessary. In this case they have decided to go with the S&P of a few agencies and impose the limits as governed by those agencies as their own. To them this is a legality concern. They pay the insurance bill. We often take for granted the use of such facilities, a use that we could soon not have.
For what it is worth I have enclosed a copy of the standards from NACD that clearly show that a Intro Cave diver is to dive a single after certification at this level of training.
7. CAVE DIVES:
Intro to Cave diver certification is based on satisfactory performance of ALL skills listed in these standards by ALL students regardless of prior training. Students will complete a minimum of four cave dives for certification and at instructor discretion one open water evaluation dive. Students using double tanks will use 1/6 air rule. If certified at this level students must be informed they can only dive with a single tank.
I do not have a copy of the current NSS-CDS S&P but I can say that they also have a similar limitation. Not all agencies have this as a limtation, In fact I teach with another agency that has no such limits. IF it is Ginnie's choice not to observe that agency's limits then that also is their right to do so.
In sport diving Ginnie does not recognize the minimum age limit of a few of the agency's and we do not hear any griffling about that.
We do not hear how the fully certified cave divers are given a reduced entry fee. Surley if there was a case of descrimination then this would be one to point out.
We do not hear how when all the other cave diving sites are closed for the day that Ginnie is still open serving the cave diver for their enjoyment or instruction. We don't see a complaint of how instructors are more than welcome to use classroom facilities for their classes.
No we do not see any of these.
What we do see is a continuation of the internet chat boards showing nothing more then a collection of limited knowledge. People who are willing to site the other guy as not following standards and just as quickly proclaim that those standards do not apply to them. people who believe that if they choose they can go and kill themselves even if it is at the expense of others.
BUT OFFICER THE TRAFFIC IS ALL MOVING AT THE SAME RATE WHY DID YOU PULL ME OVER? Because you are going 80 mph in a 60 mph speed zone you violated the limits please sign here mam.
I can find no statistics that have shown an Intro diver diving a single tank where equipment was contributed to their fatality. Perhaps the diver on the single tank is more likely to check their pressure gauge. The intro to cave diver is not just limited to a single cylinder, they are also limited to avoiding decompression. This means that the Intro diver must have awareness of not just their air but their time status and as a result both will limit thie penetration all the time whilst building up their skills and awareness of the cave environment. PArt of the purpose to which this level of certification was intended. The other purpose was because there are divers out there who have no desire to move further on into cave diving and just like the opportunity to dive the occasional cave in its simplist form.
All this thread has done is shown the bad side of cave diving. IMO Ginnie is alright
Kudos to Ginnie Springs Staff,
The staff at Ginnie have done nothing wrong in telling Intro-to-cave divers that they cannot use doubles unless they are in possession of a signed waiver by their instructor.
Ginnie is not a facility that is public, they are private and as such they have the right to impose any restriction they deem necessary. In this case they have decided to go with the S&P of a few agencies and impose the limits as governed by those agencies as their own. To them this is a legality concern. They pay the insurance bill. We often take for granted the use of such facilities, a use that we could soon not have.
For what it is worth I have enclosed a copy of the standards from NACD that clearly show that a Intro Cave diver is to dive a single after certification at this level of training.
7. CAVE DIVES:
Intro to Cave diver certification is based on satisfactory performance of ALL skills listed in these standards by ALL students regardless of prior training. Students will complete a minimum of four cave dives for certification and at instructor discretion one open water evaluation dive. Students using double tanks will use 1/6 air rule. If certified at this level students must be informed they can only dive with a single tank.
I do not have a copy of the current NSS-CDS S&P but I can say that they also have a similar limitation. Not all agencies have this as a limtation, In fact I teach with another agency that has no such limits. IF it is Ginnie's choice not to observe that agency's limits then that also is their right to do so.
In sport diving Ginnie does not recognize the minimum age limit of a few of the agency's and we do not hear any griffling about that.
We do not hear how the fully certified cave divers are given a reduced entry fee. Surley if there was a case of descrimination then this would be one to point out.
We do not hear how when all the other cave diving sites are closed for the day that Ginnie is still open serving the cave diver for their enjoyment or instruction. We don't see a complaint of how instructors are more than welcome to use classroom facilities for their classes.
No we do not see any of these.
What we do see is a continuation of the internet chat boards showing nothing more then a collection of limited knowledge. People who are willing to site the other guy as not following standards and just as quickly proclaim that those standards do not apply to them. people who believe that if they choose they can go and kill themselves even if it is at the expense of others.
BUT OFFICER THE TRAFFIC IS ALL MOVING AT THE SAME RATE WHY DID YOU PULL ME OVER? Because you are going 80 mph in a 60 mph speed zone you violated the limits please sign here mam.
I can find no statistics that have shown an Intro diver diving a single tank where equipment was contributed to their fatality. Perhaps the diver on the single tank is more likely to check their pressure gauge. The intro to cave diver is not just limited to a single cylinder, they are also limited to avoiding decompression. This means that the Intro diver must have awareness of not just their air but their time status and as a result both will limit thie penetration all the time whilst building up their skills and awareness of the cave environment. PArt of the purpose to which this level of certification was intended. The other purpose was because there are divers out there who have no desire to move further on into cave diving and just like the opportunity to dive the occasional cave in its simplist form.
All this thread has done is shown the bad side of cave diving. IMO Ginnie is alright
