iantd advanced nitrox vs. tdi advanced nitrox

[padiscubapro]

DeepScuba once bubbled...
Thanks for the info padiscubapro

By the way, I'm a certified gas blender and mix and dive my own Trimix if I want to, without the (Trimix) card!!!!:wacko:

NOW start the flame-throwers!!!!!!!!

I guess I know "Which" of my "Instructor" buddies are coming with me to do the Doria!!!

Hahah

Where there's a will, there's a way!

SEEKER!!!! I thought they didn't even ask!!!!!

Hahahahah

P.S> Like I've said padiscubapro, I know the math, and the rest is just diving experience, card or no card at THAT Point. I'm NOT talking padi OW to TDI Full Trimix in a week!

Ooooohhh I can feel the heat already on the seat of my pants!!!!

regards, kids.

I mixed and dive my own for many years before I was mix certified.. The requirement to show proof is what originally made me get mix certified.. The boats are now all trying to cover their as*es. Hey, If you can get your instructor buddy to take responsiblity for you thats great and I see nothing wrong with it.. but he will have to sign your waiver as the responsible party..
I know I would do the same (for a friend) but then he'd be signing a waiver to me and would follow my profiles and dive with me...

 

[DeepScuba]

Aw, we're doing the Gunilda anyways. They won't ask us squat

Hahahah, hey I'm just kidding, I don't know that, I'm just kidding.

Well about the asking us thing.

I guess we're just the "old" school in the new age. We'll do stuff the "Agencies" say we're not qualified to do, so what.

Some call it dumb, some call it cavalier..whatever. What did everyone else do before there were mixed gas classes?

We're far more educated (as a whole) now than they were even 10-15 years ago.

I'm not saying it's right or wrong. I'm just saying what people can do without the "Agency's" approval BUT with training. Info, GOOD info is easy to get.

Regards.




:flame:

 

[DeepTechScuba]

Yes, Darlene, the TDI cards say 330 now. I guess Brett went international (as in metric) and so for the advanced card to read "100m/330ft" the math had to tie out!

Yes, I agree with Darlene, that there is beauty in an entry level mix course. Here is why.

A tech instructor I know once bubbled: "In technical diving the thing that is most likely to kill you is BREATHING THE WRONG GAS AT THE WRONG DEPTH." True, true.

So here are five various ways that a trimix dive can kill you, especially if you are a student, but not limited to students alone:

1) You start to breathe your backgas on the surface before you are deep enough for the ppO2 in it to be able to sustain consciousness;

2) You use the wrong stage tank as your travel mix and you breath on it too long, hoping to save backgas, and you tox;

3) You have a backgas problem at MOD and you panic and switch to either of your deco mixes and you tox;

4) You cannot keep track of all of your hoses wrapped around your body and neck and you put the wrong second stage (used to be called "your mouthpiece") in your mouth at the wrong depth and you tox;

5) You switch during ascent to your rich mix too deep mistakening it for your lean mix and you tox.

As Vixen has already pointed out, a normoxic mix class eliminates 2 out of the 5 above ways you could die on mix.

Regarding TDI's advanced deep air class (aka extended range), I completely agree that this course is a farce. I remember being totally narked at 185 fsw during that class, and I did not get anything at all out of it, other than about $500 poorer for having paid for it.

 

[Scuba_Vixen]

"Nearest I can guess is they figure if you can handle a controlled ascent and a couple deco gasses after having the snot narced out of you, you can handle about anything. "

That about sums up task loading though, ...and as you say, the normoxic part of Advanced was a baby step from there. (unless it's changed, TDI used to be 180fsw for ER).....Wouldn't mind seeing that revised back some....

Darlene

 

[padiscubapro]

DeepTechScuba once bubbled...
Yes, Darlene, the TDI cards say 330 now. I guess Brett went international (as in metric) and so for the advanced card to read "100m/330ft" the math had to tie out!

Yes, I agree with Darlene, that there is beauty in an entry level mix course. Here is why.

A tech instructor I know once bubbled: "In technical diving the thing that is most likely to kill you is BREATHING THE WRONG GAS AT THE WRONG DEPTH." True, true.

So here are five various ways that a trimix dive can kill you, especially if you are a student, but not limited to students alone:

1) You start to breathe your backgas on the surface before you are deep enough for the ppO2 in it to be able to sustain consciousness;

2) You use the wrong stage tank as your travel mix and you breath on it too long, hoping to save backgas, and you tox;

3) You have a backgas problem at MOD and you panic and switch to either of your deco mixes and you tox;

4) You cannot keep track of all of your hoses wrapped around your body and neck and you put the wrong second stage (used to be called "your mouthpiece") in your mouth at the wrong depth and you tox;

5) You switch during ascent to your rich mix too deep mistakening it for your lean mix and you tox.

As Vixen has already pointed out, a normoxic mix class eliminates 2 out of the 5 above ways you could die on mix.

Regarding TDI's advanced deep air class (aka extended range), I completely agree that this course is a farce. I remember being totally narked at 185 fsw during that class, and I did not get anything at all out of it, other than about $500 poorer for having paid for it.

The only hoses that get necklaced to you are your back gas regs.. no other mix shoud be there.. as for stages, I teach in all my clases whether it be ANDI or TDI, to use the ANDI gas switch protocol and labeling.. Whenever more than 1 mix is used all second stages are tagged in a manner where the contents are visible to your buddy, so if you put the wrong reg in your mouth your buddy immediately knows, and all gas switches are signaled... no exceptions....

every single one of those are avoidable with the above protocol... no gas switches are done without your buddy... period..

If the TDI ext range is taught properly its about dive planning and skill training.. there is no need (or requiremente) to go to the max 180 fsw.. all my ext range classes are taught to a max of 50m, with some students shallower.. It all depends on my evaluation of them at depth... all that is required is that the dives be conducted to at least 40m. The ONLY exception I would have to this is if the student tells me hes going to a place like bikini or truk where he/she is planning deep air dives, In a controlled enviroment I would extend the depth so under a controlled situation the diver could evaluate themselves... I would make sure they do some skill to demonstrate the narcosis just in case the person doesn't "feel" or remember the narcosis..

Skills can be overlearned enough to become automatic enough to in most likely hood save you butt.. Its not something I recommend But I acknowledge people will do it as I have done (I don;t believe in being a hypocrite) myself when it was necessary.. but thats my personal decision..

 

[DeepScuba]

Now you see DTScuba (My distant cousin) you could probably add even more reason to that list, but it still all boils down to all those things being "academic". AS in, you KNOW they are mental errors.

They need not be specific to and "Advanced" class, but are taught even at the "Entry" level.

We are assuming folks are smart enough to wanna survive, so they'll take it seriously. If not, as you guys say, Darwin's waiting for you!

AS a case in point, I simply wouldn't be doing 185-200 on air. I didn't need any class to inform me that it's on the edge of what some people call safety. Why is anyone getting narced at those depths when they don't need to be?

Oooops, there's my 80% DIR thinking coming out. But I believe it's a safe practice (Mix over air, beyond XXXft)


As far as gas swithces, I agree with PAdiS/Pro, they are academic, and when performed correctly, are not a problem.

AS I said earlier, and I will refine it more here, Tech students are far more academically astute (when it comes to theory) than they were 10-15 years ago.

This, combined with practice, makes for better, safer divers.