Hog harness: stop stuff from moving around waist belt?

[TSandM]

In fact, we had a lecture in Fundies on the inadvisability of doing deep diving in thick wetsuits, simply because it's virtually impossible to create a balanced rig in those circumstances.

The OP was carrying 10 lbs of total ballast. He could divide that into six on the cambands and four on his waist, and have four pounds easily jettisoned. A weight belt with four pounds on it really can't be a nuisance to anybody. If you assume he is diving an Al80 (which he certainly would have been in MX), he's carrying four of those pounds to sink his tank. That means his wetsuit is no more than six pounds positive at the surface, which is the maximum amount of lift he can lose. Therefore, if his wing totally failed at depth (pulled the corrugated hose off is about the only way that is going to happen), he really can't be more than ten pounds negative (and it's unlikely to lose ALL the lift from the suit) and he should be able to swim that up, or at least I can, and I'm no Mark Spitz.

I'm in the camp that the main reason for having ditchable weight is to be able to make yourself (or someone else) irretrievably positive on the surface. I do think that is not a bad idea, and especially for new divers. A four pound weight belt would do that very neatly for stuart.

 

[tbone1004]

Thank you much Lynn.

To Dumpster

I don't, I dive a balanced rig, granted unfortunately too negative, but that is unavoidable with cave configurations. I have a drysuit for most of those dives, and if I am diving in a wetsuit, I carry a 50lb lift bag. The only time I dive with ditchable weight is when I am travelling and it is cold enough to use a wetsuit. That is typically only 6-8lbs for ocean diving with an al80 in a 5mm. You don't dive thick wetsuits deep because it isn't safe unless you have redundant buoyancy, either in a dual bladder, or more preferably a lift bag. In either of those situations there is no need for ditchable weight.

I am well aware wetsuits can compress more than that, I grew up in New England where 7mm farmer johns are standard.
As he said he only had 10lbs, that means that his can only lose 10lbs assuming it loses all buoyancy, which they never do, will lose most of it, but not all.

Total wing failure means that the wing holds absolutely 0 air, meaning no orientation you hold that wing will hold enough air to keep that rig to the surface. I highly doubt you have had multiples on modern equipment, if you have, it is likely your fault. If you do proper positive pressure checks on the wing like you are supposed to before you get in the water, the only way to cause that is a tear which is highly unlikely with the quality of modern wings. You can almost always get some air into that rig at the surface to help keep you afloat, you shouldn't need it at the bottom, if you can't kick a rig up you shouldn't be diving that rig, plain and simple.

Also bull f*cking sh!t you were 70lbs positive and had a controlled ascent at anything less than 100ft/minute unless you have fins the size of an orca, please post that video here so we can judge your "effortless and controlled" ascent ourselves. Dropping the weight belt I MIGHT be able to see at 30lbs, but there is absolutely no effing way you were 70lbs positive at depth, plus the buoyancy gained by the wetsuit, and you were able to have anything remotely "controlled". That is nothing short of suicidal.

 

[stuartv]

Take the old not big enough harness that you had to replace, buy a waist belt buckle for $5 from DGX or whatever they're charging and make your own.

Funny you should say that! I pulled that old piece of webbing out of my office trash can last night with that very thought in mind. I don't know what I was thinking throwing it away!

And thanks for that link to the GUE page. I had not seen that particular page before. I just read the whole thing. VERY informative. There are a number of things there that are done for reasons that don't really apply to my diving - at least, not yet. But, I like to follow standards when I don't have a good reason not to, so I will definitely adopt the practices documented there for things I'm doing now (e.g. light placement/stowage, instrument placement, etc.).

 

[tbone1004]

what things aren't applicable? Aside from the long hose and doubles, everything else is applicable.

 

[stuartv]

Equipment Configuration | Global Underwater Explorers

An odd note... Starting from the GUE home page, I can't find any way to get back to this Equipment page. I assume it can found via Google and a direct link, but you'd think there would be some link to this page on some other part of the GUE website. And maybe there is, but I can't find it.

 

[TSandM]

The nice thing about the GUE approach is that everything works perfectly well from day one, but also continues to do so if you progress into more complicated diving. We start all our private OW students in a GUE gear configuration and teach them GUE procedures and protocols. Begin as you mean to go on . . . and it works. The students we teach through the dive shop do not start that way, but the ones who have become active local divers have all converted to the system after diving with people using it and observing how it functions.

 

[stuartv]

what things aren't applicable? Aside from the long hose and doubles, everything else is applicable.

Long hose, doubles, canister light, spare mask, for sure. I don't think I really need to ditch my fins in favor of ones I can attach a spring strap with no buckles to, either. And I will continue to just wear a snorkel on my mask strap if I'm doing anything that might involve any distance of surface swim.

And I may (MAY, mind you ) put on an extra D ring or two on my harness, if I decide it will make things more convenient for diving with my GoPro.

That's all I can think of right now, anyway.

 

[PfcAJ]

A wing can certainly lose all of it's positive buoyancy. The corrugated hose can pop off when you jump in the water. All the air will QUICKLY come out.

Your immediate options include vigorous vertical swimming, ditching some weight, or inflating a drysuit, and possibly a domination of all those things depending on exactly how you have your kit configured.

Any action that that requires digging in a pocket (lift bag...) or attaching some extra inflator tucked away somewhere (dual cell wing) is fantasy land stuff.

 

[stuartv]

The nice thing about the GUE approach is that everything works perfectly well from day one

So what WOULD be the GUE way of carrying my GoPro on a dive?

My requirements would be:

- quick and easy to whip it out and start filming something
- reasonably quick and easy to stow when I want to have both hands free for something else
- sometimes dive with it in northing more than its OEM u/w housing. Other times, dive with it mounted to a Goodman handle with a Loc-line-mounted light.

 

[TSandM]

The links to the gear article were lost when the website was redone about a year ago. Annoys the stink out of me.

You don't need doubles or a canister light for typical recreational diving, but putting a light on a Goodman handle makes life a lot easier. A lot of us don't carry a spare mask for shallow dives, but I saved a dive a few years ago when I got rolled in the surf and lost the one I was wearing, and we couldn't find it again -- but the one in my pocket let me go diving anyway. Spring or elastic straps are the best thing since sliced bread, and if you try them, you will NEVER go back to standard fin straps (nor will you lose a fin underwater ever again). And you don't need any more d-rings -- a lot of us carry cameras of various sorts, and the left chest d-ring works great as a place to park them, at least until or unless you start carrying stages.

Snorkels? Well, if you are surface swimming somewhere where there is fun stuff to see while you surface swim, snorkels are great. If not, it's a lot easier to swim on your back. I never wear one on my mask, though. And as your gas consumption falls with experience and improved technique, the small amount of gas you might breathe through a regulator while surface swimming will cease to concern you.