Halcyon sueing OxyCheq, US Divers and others?

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weekender:
I got that. No worries, i was kidding around also.

Zombie if you go to the OMS site you'll see that you can get a bladder you just described. I dive in the NE where oms is popular and based. im always amazed how many people on this site bash their products. i had no idea all of us up here had junk for gear and are unsafe divers because of it. thanks for the thoughtful input.

Weekender,

I am from SE FL and dive with OMS gear. Imagine the beating I take when I go out on Brownie's boat! They all tend to repel away from me like I have the plague. It's cute though, how they all look like lemmings when they giant stride one right after the other into the ocean! :)
 
sorry for the long post...

Well what about Seaquest BCD's that have an integrated weight system? Wouldn't that fall under the same patent infringement?


I think we've gone off topic here in a number of instances. But just to put my .02 worth...this all really depends on how strongly to feel in either case. If the lawsuit really is a burning issue with you than you have the right to choose equipment based on your feelings. After all, it wouldn't be the first time in US history that people have chosen to boycott a business due to it's practices. If however, you feel the suit is irrelevant in your decision making process than by all means include Halcyon as a possible vendor.
Just as an example...remember when PADI was forced to pay nearly 200K to Diverlink for court fees because of a ludicrous lawsuit? In my mind it didn't make people (including myself) get rid of their PADI cards albeit it made me bash their stupidity.

This happens in our society among companies. You just need to decide what's more important to you. Halycyon vs. other products. Nike's made in Vietnam vs. New Balance made in the U.S., Ford's vs. Chevy, etc.

Oh and one more thing that's off topic...being a Croatian-American...comparing Croatian views of Americans with that of the French is ludicrous. I've lived in Croatia, have many friends there and have discussed (in Croatian) mind you their views on us here. They are wrong in some instances, but that's because they don't like my conservative views concerning for example lying under oath...ahem, but loved our Dem.'s. Anyway, I've never seen any of my Croatian freinds "bash" American tourists...just make fun of our policies which is no more than we do ourselves. The only Anti-American sentimitism I felt was due to my conservative nature.

Jos jedna stvar...ne kaze se "Black humor" nego "Dark Humor". Ako se bukvalno prevodi onda ste u pravu...ali to nije izreka koja se upotrebljava....just FYI.
 
mars2u:
Well what about Seaquest BCD's that have an integrated weight system? Wouldn't that fall under the same patent infringement?

Yes, but Dive Rite, OMS, Abysmal and Oxycheq are direct competition for Halcyon (backplates, double and single tank wings and lights in DR and OMS's case), Aqua Lung and the like aren't, not to mention Apeks seem to be the choice regs.

Ben
 
mars2u:
Oh and one more thing that's off topic...being a Croatian-American...comparing Croatian views of Americans with that of the French is ludicrous. I've lived in Croatia, have many friends there and have discussed (in Croatian) mind you their views on us here. They are wrong in some instances, but that's because they don't like my conservative views concerning for example lying under oath...ahem, but loved our Dem.'s. Anyway, I've never seen any of my Croatian freinds "bash" American tourists...just make fun of our policies which is no more than we do ourselves. The only Anti-American sentimitism I felt was due to my conservative nature..

You misread. No one put an = between French and Croatia. The French have much better food. :bonk: Read all the posts. There was some ribbing going on between the posters. Everyone else is making it into something it wasn't.
 
mempilot:
Ryan,

Why would you do anything drastic with your bp/wing regardless of the outcome of this lawsuit? You have the equip, whether you like the company or not - it is still good equip.

Yup, still good equipment. But I want to keep the possibility open that I'd sell my/not buy a company's gear if what they do business-wise does not aggree with my morals.

I wouldn't want to support something/someone I though was bad.

Ryan
 
OneBrightGator:
Yes, but Dive Rite, OMS, Abysmal and Oxycheq are direct competition for Halcyon (backplates, double and single tank wings and lights in DR and OMS's case), Aqua Lung and the like aren't, not to mention Apeks seem to be the choice regs.

Not only that, but if you read the patents it appears to cover only weight integration with fastex clip releases (unless I've missed something)

Now, among those served, find those that do not make such a device.

If you find any such examples, decide if it is reasonable to conclude that this is an attempt to drive competitors from the market, rather than legitimately enforce a patent.

Also, FWIW, perjuring yourself by filing a patent application without listing all known prior art (which you are required to do) is also a problem of ethics at minimum.

There is a relatively simple change that could be made to patent law to fix this kind of abuse - if your patent is thrown out due to undisclosed prior art, you are responsible for all costs incurred by those who you tried to enjoin as a matter of statute (that is, its not a matter of discretion); you should already be held responsible for suing someone for patent infringement that doesn't even manufacture the device you claim is bring infringed (but to the extent that such sanctions are discretionary, they need to be made mandatory)

That would make frivolous patent games EXTREMELY dangerous to play.

Until those changes are made in the law the only reasonable response to people pulling this kind of thing is to boycott their products and services.

BTW, Cronin "got his" for his frivolous suit against Diverlink. Not only did they get popped for fees and costs under California's Anti-SLAPP statute, but Cronin himself personally expired shortly thereafter.

During the time this was pending and up until justice was done, I indeed did boycott PADI.
 
mars2u:
Jos jedna stvar...ne kaze se "Black humor" nego "Dark Humor". Ako se bukvalno prevodi onda ste u pravu...ali to nije izreka koja se upotrebljava....just FYI.

U redu. Jako mi je žao. Vidimo se! Let's dive together sometime. :)
 
rcrs007:
Just articles, press releases on the subject. Maybe they'd have more pertinant info as they're closer to the lawsuit.

Some did say this lawsuit has been kept quiet, maybe there are no "non 2nd hand 3rd hand etc" sources of info ?

Ryan

Lawsuits, when filed, are generally public record...As for being kept quiet, there may just be no interest in writing about it...Not sure why there would be a press release, unless there was a favorable disposition for the person making the release.

I haven't seen the Suunto lawsuit or any press releases, etc. on it, but am aware of it because I came across it by accident through routine work I do.
 
Genesis:
BTW, Cronin "got his" for his frivolous suit against Diverlink. Not only did they get popped for fees and costs under California's Anti-SLAPP statute, but Cronin himself personally expired shortly thereafter.

That's a low blow Karl, being happy about who was right winning is one thing, being happy that person died is digusting.

Ben
 
Genesis:
Also, FWIW, perjuring yourself by filing a patent application without listing all known prior art (which you are required to do) is also a problem of ethics at minimum.

Well, to clarify, a US patent applicant is required to submit relevant prior art of which they are aware, but they are not required to do a search to find art they don't already have.

If such prior art is obvious in the industry, you'd think that the lawsuit(s) would go away quickly...Someone mentioned that some defendants have settled for hundreds of thousands of dollars...Seems to me that one could reasonably draw an inference from that (assuming it is true) that the settling defendants didn't believe they had a defense to mount that would cost less than the settlement amount...
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/peregrine/

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