DIR- Generic GUE Standards Update (v 10.1)

[Nick_Radov]

I know they conducted two classes only last there and it was on the Britannic at depths of about 120 meters.

It's funny how 25 years ago diving the HMHS Britannic at all was considered a major expedition requiring years of planning, and now it's just the final experience dive for a certification class. Times have certainly changed. I'll probably never reach the Tech 3 level but it's great to see now new techniques and technologies have expanded possibilities.

Quest 1.2 | GUE

www.gue.com

 

[digitalMechanic]

I am curious if the rec to tech upgrade for Fundies would still be an option, or people will have to retake the Fundies(Tech) for a technical rating.

This is the answer I got for the exact same question from the GUE Facebook account:

Hi guys, great question! Yes, for the next few months your instructors can still schedule the GUE Fundamentals Upgrade, or starting in the next few days, your instructor can also schedule it as an Upgrade to GUE Technical Fundamentals if you meet the new course Technical Fundamentals prerequisites and would like to pursue the new rating.

 

[ginti]

I just finished reading that part and yep it does look like so (but: disclaimer I didn't read the version before). I wonder if it affects instructors who did their qualifications prior to this new document but hasn't been signed off yet?

Here is the previous version:

https://www.gue.com/files/Standards_and_Procedures/GUE-Standards-v9.2.pdf

 

[Nick_Radov]

Every single class requiring the rescue primer or equivalent class is interesting and a bit annoying.

I asked GUE on Facebook and they replied that there is a 6 month grace period before the prerequisites in Standards version 10.1 take effect. So if your class is within the next 6 months then Rescue Primer (or equivalent) isn't required but after that period it will be required for most of the higher level courses.

 

[ginti]

Every single class requiring the rescue primer or equivalent class is interesting and a bit annoying.

Why annoying?

To me, it makes sense.

To get a tech pass, you needed to go through rec1 and rec2; rec2 includes rescue premier, so divers who went through this path automatically had it.

The other way was fundies. almost all divers who approached fundies already have a rescue card. However, one could in theory get to fundies after OW, and thus not having some rescue training which is quite important - I imagine this standard is just to ensure this component is not missing

EDIT: fundies still doesn't require any rescue training, which also makes sense to me

 

[gregbenson314]

I also think having a rescue primer (or equivalent) makes sense. I assume that includes courses like PADI/SSI rescue etc rather than only GUE's primer.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but with the previous standards, you could become a tech or cave diver without training in different rescue scenarios, only a controlled diver lift as part of the tech pass criteria (NB I am only a fundies rec pass so if rescue techniques are included in T1 or C1 then happy to edit this).

This way just adds another layer of safety which should be there, but technically might not have been.

 

[Dex~]

I also think having a rescue primer (or equivalent) makes sense. I assume that includes courses like PADI/SSI rescue etc rather than only GUE's primer.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but with the previous standards, you could become a tech or cave diver without training in different rescue scenarios, only a controlled diver lift as part of the tech pass criteria (NB I am only a fundies rec pass so if rescue techniques are included in T1 or C1 then happy to edit this).

This way just adds another layer of safety which should be there, but technically might not have been.

You are correct that previously, rescue training was not a prerequisite, and unconscious diver lifts were only required during tech upgrades or tech/cave/CCR courses at all levels. This was a gap, as having rescue skills, basic life support, first aid, and oxygen administration is crucial for this type of diving. Accidents can occur, and without the ability to respond effectively, you could jeopardize someone's life.

Additionally, under the new standards, rescue training from other equivalent agencies is accepted, so it is not mandatory to complete Rescue Premier. However, I highly recommend it if you plan to pursue GUE training to ensure you receive the high-quality instruction that GUE classes typically provide and known for.

 

[crofrog]

I asked GUE on Facebook and they replied that there is a 6 month grace period before the prerequisites in Standards version 10.1 take effect. So if your class is within the next 6 months then Rescue Primer (or equivalent) isn't required but after that period it will be required for most of the higher level courses.

It’s not listed as a prerequisite it’s in the "Training standards" section my understanding is the certification will not be issued until the rescue class is completed, but you're able to attend the class.

Why annoying?

To me, it makes sense.

I agree that having a common sheet of music for rescue inside the community makes sense, and it would make more sense if it required the GUE Rescue primer with no equivalency accepted so that rescue SOPS could be trained and implemented and the quality could be consistently ensured.

It's annoying because I'm getting ready to schedule C2 and now I need to make sure there are another 2 training days available to take the rescue primer.

To get a tech pass, you needed to go through rec1 and rec2; rec2 includes rescue premier, so divers who went through this path automatically had it.

The other way was fundies. almost all divers who approached fundies already have a rescue card.

That's not true. You could (and I have) gone open water -> tech fundies and the classes in the technical pipeline. I've not prioritized the rescue class because frankly I didn't see a significant amount of value in it for me. I've had TCCC-CLS training, BLS training, wilderness first aid training, and mountain rescue training.

 

[whynot]

ETA: In hindsight, my response competes with @crofrog 's in terms of redundancy - but, whatev...

Why annoying?

To me, it makes sense.

To get a tech pass, you needed to go through rec1 and rec2; rec2 includes rescue premier, so divers who went through this path automatically had it.

First off, no - only Rec1 (OW) was required to take Fundies and pursue a tech pass. Second, and most notably, this road was **rarely** ever taken.

The other way was fundies. almost all divers who approached fundies already have a rescue card. However, one could in theory get to fundies after OW, and thus not having some rescue training which is quite important - I imagine this standard is just to ensure this component is not missing

Again, no - "almost all divers who approached fundies did [+not] already have a rescue card".

I am a member of one of the oldest and largest GUE communities in North America (and IIRC, the World) - I am prefacing with that to be able to say that a lot of divers taking Fundies here (and elsewhere), if not the entire cohort in some class instances, are just OW divers, sometimes AOW. Though I agree with you that "having some rescue training which is quite important," that isn't what you were asserting.

 

[ginti]

I agree that having a common sheet of music for rescue inside the community makes sense, and it would make more sense if it required the GUE Rescue primer with no equivalency accepted so that rescue SOPS could be trained and implemented and the quality could be consistently ensured.

I imagine that would make the barrier to entering the GUE route too high, and most people would avoid it. Like it or not, economic sustainability is necessary to sustain an organization...

But I agree that the quality consistence should be ensured, maybe this is something to expect from the next version of the standards

It's annoying because I'm getting ready to schedule C2 and now I need to make sure there are another 2 training days available to take the rescue primer.

I understand the annoyance. However, in all honesty, I would do it (I am planning it in the first half of next year, again, just to refresh my skills, and independently of the standards).

By the way, if you do the class in the first 6 months of 2025, you might be exempted by the new requisites as far as I know.

Anyway, even if for a few people it could be annoying, overall I consider it a huge improvement

That's not true. You could (and I have) gone open water -> tech fundies and the classes in the technical pipeline. I've not prioritized the rescue class because frankly I didn't see a significant amount of value in it for me. I've had TCCC-CLS training, BLS training, wilderness first aid training, and mountain rescue training.

I said "almost" all divers, not all divers