Ginnie 3-18-2012

[cruiser]

"no"


Make sense?

It does now. At first glance I thought it was a typo that could have gone two ways:

they do noT require a buddy be with you
they do noW require a buddy be with you

 

[Ayisha]

On another forum, a poster (who also posts on SB) made an interesting observation. If you leave the stairs at the surface and swim toward the eye entrance, you can see the entrance to the ear to your left. You know the two entrances meet at beginning of the main line. What if you wanted to enter through the eye and exit at the ear? What you see before your very eyes tells you to go into until you meet the starting point and then turn left. If you look at the map (posted above) though, you will see that the entrance from the eye takes you past the ear, and you actually have to turn right. If you are looking for an opening to your left, what you will find is the catacombs.

This really makes sense. I can picture a diver thinking he is going toward the exit he believes is that way, but he is instead getting deeper and more lost. How terrifying.

 

[Pedro Burrito]

In 1989 my AOW experiance dives were done at Blue grotto - all the way back and around the line for 2 dives. I would not recomend it.

I was in the Blue Grotto last month. The Blue Grotto was filled with students, including at least four wearing dry suits and doubles planning three hour dives. When we got out of the water, someone told me that he had counted 65 divers in the water at once. My son was working on his AOW and the instructor took him and another student down to the bottom for the deep dive and I tagged along. It was really dark and murky down there by the time we got to the bottom. I was not happy with the choice although my son loved it and now wants cave training. I should have taken him to the Keys for his AOW check out dives.

Never again for me, I'm not a cave/cavern diver.

 

[Dive-aholic]

Someone questioned my comment earlier about someone "wandering in to the catacombs". I am sorry I did not quote it or remember it. Internet is very slow here, especially this board. Took me 30 minutes just to view the new pages.

Anyway, I still stand behind that comment. I don't think anyone "wanders" in to the catacombs. I have dove them before and love them. The person made the decision to dive in to the cavern zone. The person made a decision to dive in to the cave. They made the decision to look just a little further and around the next corner. They made a decision to leave the light zone. They made the decision to dive above their level of training. It is possible they even made the decision to take a light, (we do not know for sure yet) which at OW they are not authorized to have. They made all these decisions after knowing good and well, Ginnie does a good job letting folks know, that he was not allowed to dive there. That is why I still say you do not wander in to the Catacombs.

Depends on how you define wanders. I've seen more than one person make the mistake of thinking the catacombs was either an exit or the main passage. If you know the cave it's easy to distinguish. If it's your first time there it's not so easy.

 

[Dive Bug Bit Me]

I suppose. Currently there is-

1. Information on the internet about not diving in caves without training
2. A waiver that states do not go in the cave without trainnig.
3. A video that states not to go in the cave without training.
4. At least 3 signs around Devils on land that state do not go in the cave without training
5. A sign in each devils eye and devils ear that states do not dive the cave without training.

If you believe a list of deaths would convince them not to do it, by all means suggest it to Rose. Personally I'm a bit skeptical.

You are an open water diver,

Your depth restriction is 60 ft, but don't worry with experience (25 dives) we will take you deeper.
You shouldn't really be diving in poor vis, but don't worry with 25 dives experience we will take you on our night dive.
You shouldn't do wreck penetration, but don't worry it's only into the bridge and there is plenty of light from the windows, besides you have plenty of OW experience.

Now this rule is special. You have your 25 dives experience, but no caves!

I suggest that a lack of respect for limits at OW /AOW is a part of the problem. If recreational diving treats other limits as guide lines, then can we expect persons to respect the one hard rule.

 

[Davemohio]

A horrible tragedy.

This dive event boggles my mind in so many ways. My head is gonna explode.

Ginnie has signs everywhere. They require C cards and forms have to be completed.

I did my cavern course there last month. if memory serves, there is the "basin" of the eye..then the cavern..and then further into the cavern you penetrate into the cave. Signs at the cave entrance.

Maybe I have had the safety factor of cave diving drilled into my head too long.

I am very saddened. Hits close to home.But don't understand why an OW diver would go there.

 

[heavierthanlead]

I am very saddened. Hits close to home.But don't understand why an OW diver would go there.

Because... it's there?

 

[JamesK]

Depends on how you define wanders. I've seen more than one person make the mistake of thinking the catacombs was either an exit or the main passage. If you know the cave it's easy to distinguish. If it's your first time there it's not so easy.

I can understand and apprciate that. I guess what I am getting at is he did not accidentally enter the cavern/cave. He may have accidentally entered that catacombs, we will never know, but he made the decision to enter the cave zone.

 

[openmindOW]

Now this rule is special. You have your 25 dives experience, but no caves! . . . If recreational diving treats other limits as guide lines, then can we expect persons to respect the one hard rule.

Good point.

Personally, I emphasize to my students: "No OW overhead environments. Overhead requires special training and gear. Period." Then I explain why: "Divers can get lost, run out of air and die." We cannot assume that students will figure this out on their own.

We have a moral duty here. This is another reason I have a problem with on-line SCUBA instruction.

 

[HIGHwing]

After just finishing a dive in the Devil's System we saw the unmistakable signs of an overdue diver. Ginnie security found a single vehicle in the parking lot with a Friday tag on the car Sunday morning. Sadly, we knew we must have just swam past the body.

IMHO, this was nothing to do with training, liability, decision making or other typical issue. The diver appears to have taken his own life quite on purpose. The autopsy will confirm the victims's sobriety, which is was in a great deal of question based on the contents of his vehicle.

I would suspend the typical speculation and analysis on this one as it's likely to be a rather unique outcome.