Ginnie 3-18-2012

[diverzach]

I have witnessed AOW students being lead around the back of Blue Grotto, and that nonsense happens everyday without being reported.

I did that on my first dive out of OW certification, lol! Not recommended as I did feel a little panicky, but it's not like you can get lost in there if you stay on that rope.

All I know is that if I ever do cave diving, it will be as conservative as possible. I'm far too afraid of drowning to take any big risks. Dying in a cave is NOT the way I want to go. I think when these fully certified cave divers get killed, it's probably due to complacency. You see the same thing in the shooting sports. Not that uncommon to see someone with decades of experience shoot themselves by accident. Once you get comfortable, you're set up for disaster.

 

[JahJahwarrior]

Does this mean Ginnie allows solo diving?

"no"


Make sense?

 

[Doppler]

I did that on my first dive out of OW certification, lol! Not recommended as I did feel a little panicky, but it's not like you can get lost in there if you stay on that rope.

However, ponder this. Let's say when the next OW grad who happens to read your posting is back there... in single file with his instructor up ahead and a DM at the back of five or six punters... let's just say they do panic because one of their regs starts to free-flow and in their panic, they rip off their mask, pull the reg out of their mouth and bolt. What happens?

Bottom line is this, any idiot can go back into a cave or cavern... it's easy, until the rottweiler hits the fan. Then there's dog **** everywhere.

DO NOT TRIVIALIZE GOING INTO AN ENVIRONMENT for which you are NEITHER TRAINED nor EQUIPPED... is that so hard to understand?

 

[Hetland]

I suppose. Currently there is-

1. Information on the internet about not diving in caves without training
2. A waiver that states do not go in the cave without trainnig.
3. A video that states not to go in the cave without training.
4. At least 3 signs around Devils on land that state do not go in the cave without training
5. A sign in each devils eye and devils ear that states do not dive the cave without training.

If you believe a list of deaths would convince them not to do it, by all means suggest it to Rose. Personally I'm a bit skeptical.

6. dive lights are forbidden to folks with less than a cavern cert. this includes aiming lights on cameras/strobes.
7. there's usually a guy standing on the other side of the parking area eyeballing folks gearing up to ensure no one with an incorrect-colored band sneaks a light

 

[Doppler]

I suppose. Currently there is-

1. Information on the internet about not diving in caves without training
2. A waiver that states do not go in the cave without trainnig.
3. A video that states not to go in the cave without training.
4. At least 3 signs around Devils on land that state do not go in the cave without training
5. A sign in each devils eye and devils ear that states do not dive the cave without training.

If you believe a list of deaths would convince them not to do it, by all means suggest it to Rose. Personally I'm a bit skeptical.

yea -- sigh -- you're right and I agree... but wish there were better grounds to argue the point... if you know what I mean.

 

[rlynch]

In 1989 my AOW experiance dives were done at Blue grotto - all the way back and around the line for 2 dives. I would not recomend it.

 

[diverzach]

However, ponder this. Let's say when the next OW grad who happens to read your posting is back there... in single file with his instructor up ahead and a DM at the back of five or six punters... let's just say they do panic because one of their regs starts to free-flow and in their panic, they rip off their mask, pull the reg out of their mouth and bolt. What happens?

Oh no doubt, especially with that black stuff that's easily kicked up you could have a lot of people panicking. From my limited experience it seems that the back should be for certified cavern divers only. I'm not for scuba police or anything, but it's not an open water dive by any definition.

 

[billgraham]

The points have been made that the diver was not trained and he was alone. It mystifies me how people convince themselves that it is ok to swim past those signs. I can tell you that even with training and a buddy, stuff can go pear shaped so fast on even the simplist cave dive that venturing in without any training is suicidal. Please take it to heart.

 

[boulderjohn]

On another forum, a poster (who also posts on SB) made an interesting observation. If you leave the stairs at the surface and swim toward the eye entrance, you can see the entrance to the ear to your left. You know the two entrances meet at beginning of the main line. What if you wanted to enter through the eye and exit at the ear? What you see before your very eyes tells you to go into until you meet the starting point and then turn left. If you look at the map (posted above) though, you will see that the entrance from the eye takes you past the ear, and you actually have to turn right. If you are looking for an opening to your left, what you will find is the catacombs.

 

[MMorgan]

I have two or three times seen people in OW gear in the bottom of the Eye tunnel where it meets the gallery. If you start in the Eye and swim down to the gallery, and then turn around to go back, the entrance to the Catacombs is right there and looks just as much like the exit as the real exit does. Without a line and being unfamiliar with the cave, it would be easy to bear right instead of left on the way back out and end up in the Catacombs. Of course, to get to this point the OW diver needs to have already made several bad decisions. It's not something that would happen by accident unless you had already broken several rules.

Mike