Force Fins VS the world (advice for first pair of fins?)

[TN Traveler]

I have never, ever said that Force Fins are the best ins for everyone or every type of diving.

If your diving involves puttering around a reef in 30-60 ft of water, with little or no current, you can get by with almost any fins.

If you routinely encounter currents or long swims, you might benefit greatly from the proper Force Fin, especially if you have problems with cramps or leg/knee problems.

For cave diving the only Force Fins I would suggest would be Hockey's or Excellorator's, because they frog kick extremely well.

If Force Fins offer you an advantage, pick the right fin for your type of diving. A lot of divers spend hundreds of dollars extra for a high end reg ot BPW but cheap out on their fins which probably are a piece of gear that would make their dive experience much better.

The reason most divers are shocked by the price of Force Fins is that their dive shop pushes them toward cheap, mass produced, plastic fins that the dive shop makes a huge margin on (as do the manufacturers).

 

[JohnnyC]

I have never, ever said that Force Fins are the best ins for everyone or every type of diving.

If your diving involves puttering around a reef in 30-60 ft of water, with little or no current, you can get by with almost any fins.

If you routinely encounter currents or long swims, you might benefit greatly from the proper Force Fin, especially if you have problems with cramps or leg/knee problems.

For cave diving the only Force Fins I would suggest would be Hockey's or Excellorator's, because they frog kick extremely well.

If Force Fins offer you an advantage, pick the right fin for your type of diving. A lot of divers spend hundreds of dollars extra for a high end reg ot BPW but cheap out on their fins which probably are a piece of gear that would make their dive experience much better.

The reason most divers are shocked by the price of Force Fins is that their dive shop pushes them toward cheap, mass produced, plastic fins that the dive shop makes a huge margin on (as do the manufacturers).

This is the most intelligent, well-reasoned post I've ever seen you make regarding Force Fins. Excellent post, devoid of specious arguments and ad hominem attacks.

Thank you.

 

[StefinSB]

I have never, ever said that Force Fins are the best ins for everyone or every type of diving.

If your diving involves puttering around a reef in 30-60 ft of water, with little or no current, you can get by with almost any fins.

If you routinely encounter currents or long swims, you might benefit greatly from the proper Force Fin, especially if you have problems with cramps or leg/knee problems.

For cave diving the only Force Fins I would suggest would be Hockey's or Excellorator's, because they frog kick extremely well.

If Force Fins offer you an advantage, pick the right fin for your type of diving. A lot of divers spend hundreds of dollars extra for a high end reg ot BPW but cheap out on their fins which probably are a piece of gear that would make their dive experience much better.

The reason most divers are shocked by the price of Force Fins is that their dive shop pushes them toward cheap, mass produced, plastic fins that the dive shop makes a huge margin on (as do the manufacturers).

Without numbers your margin statements are rather pointless.

 

[TN Traveler]

I will provide numbers right after you provide me numbers that prove that a BPW with an "H" on it provides better performance than a Hog wing with a generic plate or that a Apex Titanium provides better performance for more than .01% of divers than a Mares M12. I will bet that. If you put most divers in a current and let them compare performance, the one item they can tell the difference with is the fins.

The argument of objective testing of fins has been going on since I started diving 47 years ago; the same as an objectively determining the best mask, and most intelligent people agree, there are too many variables to do it. But it is a great argument for trolls who don't want to consider ther might be product that provides better performance.

Just so you know, my wife normally does not dive Force Fins - she found a pair of Free Dive fins that she uses whenever she can (she hates booties).

 

[stuartv]

If you routinely encounter currents or long swims, you might benefit greatly from the proper Force Fin, especially if you have problems with cramps or leg/knee problems.

Just so you know, my wife normally does not dive Force Fins - she found a pair of Free Dive fins that she uses whenever she can (she hates booties).

I got some freediving fins last year. They are great for currents or long swims. They also work better than any of my other fins for frog kicks, helipcopter turns and back kicks. The only time I use anything else is diving dry, where I want fins that are significantly negative in buoyancy, or when I might be going into a constricted space, like a wreck.

I've used them on boats with rough surface conditions and shore dives in Hawaii (i.e. rocky) with rough surf with no problems. Once I read the trick of turning the heel inside out for donning/doffing, that became nearly as easy as using spring straps.

My freediving fins have replaceable blades. I expect them to last indefinitely. But, I can swap the blades if I ever want something stiffer or more flexible.

They cost less than $90. It is very hard for me to imagine any fin actually working better than these do - outside of a constricted environment or needing negative fins - much less enough better to be worth even $200 (to me).

 

[Bob Evans]

Let the Gorilla have the last word.

 

[stuartv]

Let the Gorilla have the last word.

Speaking strictly for myself, the only thing I got out of that video is that I am even more leery of Force Fins.

One, you talked about not having the fin hang off your foot. A pair of neutral fins, in the water, doesn't make my foot bend in any direction. They're neutral. I'm neutral. No bending or hanging I think you meant to make some other point, but it was lost on me.

Two, it was clear to see that the Force Fin touches the diver's foot on the sole of the foot, the top of the instep, and the back of the heel. Just like any other open heel fin. Again, I think you meant to convey something other than what I got, and it was lost on me. What I got was that it attaches to my body in the same spots as my other fins and the weight of the fin (when I'm out of the water) is going to torque my foot downwards, just like any other fin. Though, if they are lighter, not by as much. But, if they are neutral in the water, that won't matter.

I'm not saying Force Fins aren't the greatest thing ever. I'm saying this video does not convey that in any way whatsoever. At least, not to me. Nothing else that I've seen does, either.

I do get cramps occasionally. Mainly when I'm swimming in water in the low 40s or colder. But, when I remember to double up on my Potassium Gluconate supplement the morning of, that doesn't seem to happen. And Potassium Gluconate is cheap.

I've never gotten cramps with my freediving fins, now that I think about it. Maybe that's because I kick so gently in those compared to my other fins. Kicking harder just results in leaving my buddy. I should talk to Dano at Mako about modding some freediving fins to work with my dry suit. Hmmm.... Might be worth having to wear ankle weights...

 

[TN Traveler]

I wish I could wear any full foot fin. First, I have never found one that was cut so it would not rub my ankle bones raw. Second, I have never found one that did not rub the front of my ankle. Third, because I have wide toes (and gout) any closed foot pocket causes extreme discomfort (this true of most open heel fins, also). The Force Fin foot pocket has made diving much more comfortable. Added to that I have bad knees and Force Fins do not stress them like standard paddle fins while still giving me the performance I need. Yes, I am a great fan of Force Fins because I don't know if I would still be diving if they were not available.

And I have never had cramps since I switched to them, no matter how hard/long I had to kick to beat a current.

 

[Bob Evans]

Free diving fins for Scuba Diving.??? Sounds like a great idea. I like to be compact like a Navy Seal. Small is good, easy to pack, great fins for small spots, like leaving a sub.

 

[scubadada]

I keep trying to cut you a break and you keep saying unsupportable things. I have tried the Pro Force Fins many times. They are mediocre for flutter kick and unusable for alternative kicks.