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Fire on safari boat Suzana in Egypt (Red Sea Aggressor)

Discussion in 'Accidents and Incidents' started by Miyaru, Nov 1, 2019.

  1. tridacna

    tridacna ScubaBoard Supporter ScubaBoard Supporter

    # of Dives: 2,500 - 4,999
    Location: New Jersey
    Random inspections to ensure that franchise standards are being met. Quite simple to deploy: Place "customers" on boats and have them report deficiencies/aberrations back to HQ.
  2. Wookie

    Wookie Secret Field Agent ScubaBoard Business Sponsor

    I guess I I’d call myself an expert on liveaboard operations. I would expect that a lot of other folks would as well. Some absolutely detest me, and wouldn’t ever agree with me, but I’ve only had one person question my safety record.

    Your expectation of Aggressor Fleet and the reality of what they actually do and offer are not quite miles apart, but they really don’t jibe either. Aggressor owns many Caribbean dive boats, including one I sold them. One of their owned boats (Carib Dancer, in the Bahamas) is the subject of much angst and many hundreds of posts regarding their terrible material condition, horrendous crew, and abysmal safety. That’s a boat they own, which I’m happy to say is doing much better now. Their franchised boats in the Pacific in Kona, Palau, etc. were their first boats franchised and Joe (the owner) has held a close relationship with the owner of Aggressor since the original owner of Aggressor (Wayne Brown is not the first owner, the man’s name was Paul Haines).

    Although Aggressor Fleet owns some boats, with the requisite fleet captains and fleet engineers (friends of mine, and I was friends with the first fleet captain and operations manager), they also have either franchise or licensing agreements with other vessels. I am not privy to the specifics of those agreements, as I never wanted to be a part of Aggressor Fleet, and the feeling was mutual.

    But that’s do know this. When you are a franchisee, you are spending 30% of your gross for 2 things. The first is access to the booking system, including office staff, and a network of travel agents. The second is the aggressor name and advertising. While I don’t know specifically if there are any requirements to maintain the boat in any specific condition, Aggressor sets a very low bar if so, considering the condition of some of their own owned vessels.

    What you seem to expect is what you see in the slick presentation at your dive shop or in the full page ads on the back of your dive magazine. And it’s true that those pictures are taken when the boat looks its finest coming out of the yard, in real life the reality is quite different. When I saw the Belize Aggressor last month I was shocked at the shoddy condition and amazed that no one seemed to be doing anything about it. I, too, have an expectation. Soot on the side of the boat like they had a busted engine didn’t meet my expectation.

    So, while you appear to think that Aggressor owes someone something, some standard of care or some standard of operation, I would suggest that the reality is that what the boat owner is actually buying is use of a name and access to a customer list and booking network, and Aggressor Fleet is collecting 30% of the revenue for those things, no more, no less.

    But I could be way off base.
  3. Land Fish

    Land Fish Barracuda

    # of Dives: 100 - 199
    Thank you very much for sharing this, and it is truly eye opening.

    I've seen a few sales and purchase agreements and licensing agreements (nothing diving or dive boat related though), still I had expected Aggressor's agreements to be along those lines, given it's an American company and how litigious the system is. I have to admit that I'm astounded by how low the bar is.

    This piece of knowledge will help me in selecting my next liveaboard. So thank you.

    Scubaboard never ceases to amaze me.

    Apologies for sidetracking the conversation.
    BigJimDiver and The Chairman like this.
  4. ScubaDiverChick84

    ScubaDiverChick84 Garibaldi

    # of Dives: 5,000 - ∞
    Location: USA
    Read this article here: California boat fire: How blaze could incinerate a 75-foot boat so fast?
    Where the owner of the aggressor is commenting on the conception fleet tragedy.

    Wayne Brown, owner of Aggressor Adventures, a global dive boat operator based out of Georgia, was skeptical oxygen fueled the disaster. Brown, who doesn’t know those involved with the Conception, said the concentration of added oxygen “doesn’t create additional risk.”

    “All ours are either aluminum or steel,” Brown said, “so fire doesn’t have much material to spread with.”
  5. NAUI Wowie

    NAUI Wowie Manta Ray

    # of Dives: 50 - 99
    Location: Silicon Valley northern CA
    Quite the opposite reaction from Truth Aquatics huh. You know Truth Aquatics is following this thread closely. I think they have been forthright, open, and heartbroken. Whereas Aggressor fleet is hoping to sweep it under the rug. Could you imagine aggressor suspending operations for even one single boat for any time at all?

    Sadly Truth Aquatics may be put out of business when large operations like aggressor that do not care continue to function.
  6. parrotheaddiver

    parrotheaddiver Loggerhead Turtle

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: Southeast of Disorder...and San Marcos, Texas
    and aren't you glad to be out of da' bidness' ;-P
    Wookie likes this.
  7. NAUI Wowie

    NAUI Wowie Manta Ray

    # of Dives: 50 - 99
    Location: Silicon Valley northern CA

    They worked hard for large tips however when it came to the real job of keeping the ship safe and afloat well......
    Anna G likes this.
  8. NAUI Wowie

    NAUI Wowie Manta Ray

    # of Dives: 50 - 99
    Location: Silicon Valley northern CA
    Id wager thats incorrect and every liveaboard captain in egypt knows about it. Just like every single airline commercial jet pilot knows about every commercial passenger jet that goes down.
    John Bantin likes this.
  9. NAUI Wowie

    NAUI Wowie Manta Ray

    # of Dives: 50 - 99
    Location: Silicon Valley northern CA
    Any of us could have been your friend and roomate. I will never use Aggressor and I do travel to locations where they operate.
    Seaweed Doc, flyboy08 and ivy202 like this.
  10. KathyV

    KathyV Orca

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: Midwestern US
    The Aggressor CEO Wayne Brown has posted this message on their website:

    Our Deepest Sympathies
    Aggressor Adventures is deeply saddened by the unfortunate events that took place in the Red Sea last week, resulting in the loss of a diver’s life. To her family and friends, we extend our deepest sympathies and condolences.

    Since the events, we have diligently worked with local resources to provide for the immediate needs of the divers aboard the vessel. This included coordinating with local government and regional embassies, to ensure these guests received the appropriate documentation to get home safely as we continue to work towards replacing their lost possessions. But there’s more work to be done. Aggressor and the vessel team on the ground are working closely with local authorities on the ongoing investigation to determine the specifics of the incident while separating facts from misinformation. It is our sincerest hope to have more information to share soon.

    In the meantime, know that we hold the vessels and crews to the highest standards of safety and service, and we’ll continue to do everything in our power to ensure our guests enjoy their adventures with us.
    DaneeHubbs likes this.

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