Filmmaker Rob Stewart dies off Alligator Reef

[cerich]

Everybody is jumping on Peter about his TruDive planning now? How many of you have really trained with him and have a leg to stand on? I am not saying there is no way that he could be at fault but I am saying that facts speak louder than some of this BS. Peter insists on using the minimum RMV for a good reason. Everything is planned on what the absolute least amount of BO gas is required. This is just used as a baseline and the individual can add the conservatism to that which they are comfortable with. The baseline remains but the amount of gas carried can vary from day to day as dive conditions warrant. It is not exactly rocket science but some of you are nothing but a lynching mob right now.

Let me break it to you, if you are planning and your goal is ABSOLUTE min amount of BO gas then you are fooling yourself, or been fooled.

Absolute min BO gas on OC will kill ya dead many times when things go pear shaped, on CCR it will killl you almost ALL of the time. So, if the whole idea of BO gas is to deal with an emergency, absolute min is most likely not going to be enough. That being the case, why even bring it? Seriously, just go "free-soloing" (to borrow a climbing term) and make it easier without even the "pretend" BO to lug around. If you want to do that, have at it, your life.

But it is my view that doing everything you can to shave carried BO gas in CCR diving is a poor approach that will yield poor results when needed. I also believe it would be amazingly irresponsible for a instructor to teach and advocate for such, unless they are marketing it truthfully "Let's make sure nobody calls you out for not enough bail out, we have come up with a great excuse that you can use to baffle those that feel you need adequate bail out gas when diving CCR"

 

[Brad_Horn]

A useful presentation for some reading this thread http://i2.wp.com/johnclarkeonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/My-presentation.jpg

From https://www.diversalertnetwork.org/...UHMSProceedings/2014_UHMS_Proceedings_WEB.pdf

 

[uwxplorer]

Everybody is jumping on Peter about his TruDive planning now? How many of you have really trained with him and have a leg to stand on? I am not saying there is no way that he could be at fault but I am saying that facts speak louder than some of this BS. Peter insists on using the minimum RMV for a good reason. Everything is planned on what the absolute least amount of BO gas is required. This is just used as a baseline and the individual can add the conservatism to that which they are comfortable with. The baseline remains but the amount of gas carried can vary from day to day as dive conditions warrant. It is not exactly rocket science but some of you are nothing but a lynching mob right now.

Sorry if that sounded like this. This was not my intention. I was simply trying to point out that I had listened to the whole thing carefully to try and understand what possible gas choice and deco parameters may have been used in the fatal dives. The whole "scenario" I used is also purely hypothetical. I looked into that to understand whether the hypoxia hypothesis was realistic or not, because I simply could not fathom that experienced divers could be caught by surprise by a low O2 cylinder content. Well, now I know that it is possible in that configuration, in that scenario. We don't know that this is what actually happened.
No blaming on my side.

EDIT: I corrected a typo where I used "dil" instead of "cylinder" (in "by a low O2 cylinder content").

 

[jonathan d iseson]

What bailout was used or typically prescribed by their methods for such dive, I have personably observed same on deeper dives and was wary

 

[oldschoolto]

This is sounding more and more like the doctor deep gas planning..... Why in the world would someone think they were smarter than the US Navy and sound diving gas mixes used by company divers ? I have learned in life ... That when a person tells you how much smarter they are then everyone else... RUN, As fast as you can...

Jim...

 

[uwxplorer]

the site owner can request a take down from wayback just FYI

OK, so just to provide evidence that I am not making this up, here is the TruDive snapshot at ~5:00 in the video:

and here is TruDive snapshot at ~10:00 in the video:

 

[St John the Diver]

planning min rmv is amazingly stupid, it's planning to die if ANYTHING goes wrong IMHO.

In a hypercapnia event, you can plan 4X your RMV for several minutes, 2X your RMV for several more, and not less than 1.5 for the balance of your time.

The other flier is that your old open circuit RMV goes WAY higher after you've been diving CCR for any time. You really don't have a clue as to what you'll need.

Any dive planning software or video of some "expert" that suggests an aluminum 40 of bottom gas for a 170 foot dive is something that ought to be in a trash can.

 

[cerich]

In a hypercapnia event, you can plan 4X your RMV for several minutes, 2X your RMV for several more, and not less than 1.5 for the balance of your time.

The other flier is that your old open circuit RMV goes WAY higher after you've been diving CCR for any time. You really don't have a clue as to what you'll need.

Any dive planning software or video of some "expert" that suggests an aluminum 40 of bottom gas for a 170 foot dive is something that ought to be in a trash can.

yup, yes, and aye.

 

[St John the Diver]

In my basic CCR course on my O2ptima rule , when you first touch the bottom, you isolate the Dil from the ADV. Run Dil manually that point on. Makes a ton of sense. Use it always

And I hope you were taught that when using 10/50 to not turn it on until you reach 20 feet or so.

"Never have an open circuit regulator in your mouth that will kill you if you breathe from it".

That's what an ADV with 10/50 on it is when you're on the surface. And lack of isolation of the ADV is what drove me to refuse diving the rEvo using hypoxic mixes.

 

[uwxplorer]

Any dive planning software or video of some "expert" that suggests an aluminum 40 of bottom gas for a 170 foot dive is something that ought to be in a trash can.

Just to clarify, TrueDive is actually not suggesting anything.
This is a user input.
You can choose 2 AL40 as bailout for a 200 ft dive if you wish (as in the demo) but you can also plan for a bad day.

Getting a bit out of topic, we are...