diver dies off redondo beach (puget sound)

[MoonWrasse]

I'm glad to provide a point at which people can vent their frustration at. I'm sorry for calling-them-as-I-see-them... and I didn't mean to imply it was her fault completely, just that it may have saved some precious minutes if she had stayed within eye contact of her buddy on the ascent.

Something not mentioned here yet: they were between 53 and 80 FSW when the incident occurred, according to the firefighters that looked at the dive computer, as reported on KIRO 7.

I don't have a problem with speculation. However if you've ever been the rescuer in a situation, it doesn't always sink in what is going on at first. You may not realize that it is a true emergency. That happened to me recently, I was swimming in a hotel pool along the bottom (ear check), when I surfaced in the shallow end, an elderly man was screaming for help. Next to him were his 2 grandkids laughing, so for a moment I thought he was playing. Reminded me of when Brando dies in the Godfather. So it took me 5-10 secs to rescue him. Perhaps EMTs, trained first responders have keener responses.

 

[Rick Murchison]

There are a couple of useful facts to keep in mind when evaluating CPR and CVAs
(1) If you're doing CPR you're starting with a corpse. If there's enough life left in the body to restart it you were just lucky.
(2) In most cases, the first symptom of a Cardio-Vascular Accident (CVA) is sudden death.
Hollywood aside, bringing someone back from no breathing/no pulse is a low percentage bet at best. That doesn't mean you shouldn't try... if you don't try you can't be the lucky one. What it does mean is that if your efforts don't work you have not failed... the victim was just already permanently dead when you started.
---
As for this accident... anyone got any more info?
Prayers aloft for the family.
Rick

 

[lamont]

so what i deleted from my last post because i got interrupted by an on-call page was that I'm actually very interested in accident analysis. but i don't think that blame and judgement should be minimized in accident analysis that is not done through primary authorities (coast guard, fire dept, NSS-CDS, etc). if you read through sheck exley's _blueprint for survival_ booklet (which i re-read just yesterday), the writing there is very even handed, and that's the style i think should be applied. there should also be some deference for the fact that we will never know all the facts if we weren't directly involved, but i don't think we should shut down all accident analysis and stick solely to condolences because we don't know all the facts because that de facto shuts down accident analysis entirely.

so while i don't appreciate the comments blaming the buddy separation for the incident i think we should look at the causes here. the biggest cause is very likely to be cardiovascular fitness, which is a little scary because this could happen to any of us. this isn't someone who swam into a cave with only OW training and equipment. again, i don't believe in judgement, but we have to be fair and point out that there can be consequences and risk due to lifestyle choices.

also i think that there was a mistake in lack of buddy contact. i don't view this as a cause because i think the outcome would likely have been the same, but i think it should be called out as a mistake. without getting into blame and judgement we should see what we can learn from that. i think that real buddy contact is one of the most difficult things to learn, and deficiencies in it are often just not noticed. the average training out there really doesn't drill home buddy contact well enough. side-by-side swimming, light contact, ascents and descents in close contact are a good start.

 

[tjohnson]

I live in the area and have listened to the media spin on several channels. The diver had lung cancer, and was undergoing chemotherapy. It’s estimated that this may have contributed in his inability to get to the surface. The media reports whatever gets the most viewer attention. Let’s give his buddy [his wife] a little support.

 

[serapis]

Sympathies to the wife. In my book she was in control and handled a situation i could never imagine . Rick hit the cpr/cva on the mark. I was EMT for years and more often then not you lose them.

 

[dannobee]

The diver had lung cancer, and was undergoing chemotherapy. It’s estimated that this may have contributed in his inability to get to the surface. The media reports whatever gets the most viewer attention. Let’s give his buddy [his wife] a little support.

A medical emergency was the first thing I thought when I read about it, not a "buddy problem." He could have been in cardiac arrest for all we know, and beyond saving, regardless of her heroic work. I commend her for all she did, and my heart goes out to her. The fact that they were both very experienced divers (and by the sound of her actions, rescue diver or higher) tells me that it probably wasn't avoidable and she did all she could.

Again, I feel for her and his family.

 

[H2Andy]

I'm glad to provide a point at which people can vent their frustration at. I'm sorry for calling-them-as-I-see-them...

you are clearly missing the point... but oh well...

as many have said, my thoughts go out to his family and friends

 

[KrisB]

you are clearly missing the point... but oh well...

as many have said, my thoughts go out to his family and friends

Really?

I mean, yeah, it is really unfortunate, but I honestly have trouble feeling sympathy for people I don't know or know someone who knows. There is an aweful lot of feigned sympathy in this world and it does no good to add to it.

From all the incident reports that have been made available, it seems as though, at the very least, we should learn that when our buddy signals some difficulty, we need to stay *very* close to him/her.

I hope that if I die in a way similar to this that people use it as an opportunity to learn, rather than to just claim sorrow and sympathy which they can't possibly feel.

Cheers,

 

[H2Andy]

the point is that we don't know what happened. you are speculating.

all you're going on is an article or two, which are known to be rather innacurate.

remember, the first report is always wrong.

 

[PugetDiver]

Really?

I mean, yeah, it is really unfortunate, but I honestly have trouble feeling sympathy for people I don't know or know someone who knows. There is an aweful lot of feigned sympathy in this world and it does no good to add to it.

From all the incident reports that have been made available, it seems as though, at the very least, we should learn that when our buddy signals some difficulty, we need to stay *very* close to him/her.

I hope that if I die in a way similar to this that people use it as an opportunity to learn, rather than to just claim sorrow and sympathy which they can't possibly feel.

Cheers,

There is nothing that I nor anyone else can learn from this accident until we get ALL the facts! (staying close to your buddy is a given and should have been learned in OW)

claim sorrow and sympathy which they can't possibly feel.

You are wrong Kris, Many of us on this board have sympathy for this family. Andy was right, you do miss the point.