Disturbing trend in diving?

[Ted Judah]

I've been somewhat taken back by the amount of hand holding offered in past warm water trips....

Me too! I'm so used to California dive boats where they just describe the dive site and then off you go!

 

[The Chairman]

I'm older and wiser now. I'd still do the dive, but not with my wife.

Ideal. We all make mistakes, and it's best to learn from them. I've made more than my share. This admission wins the internet for this month!!!

When I finally got around to getting certified, I was taught by a caver. He took me all the way to DM for $500. Woo woo. My deep dive/multilevel diving was done at Blue Spring just outside of Orange City Florida. There's a "Don't go further, you're gonna die" sign at about 60 ft. We kept swimming down to our planned depth of 80 ft. It was pretty darn dark. He held out his hand, and then proceeded to lead me deeper into the cave. Deeper and deeper. I couldn't see a thing, but I still had a hold of his hand. At the bottom (120FFW) I was clearly narced. I felt goofy. I remembered from his stories of daring do, that we had to stick to one side of the cave as we entered and exited. So, I let go of his hand and grabbed his wing on the other side. Then we started swimming all around Cork Rock. Back and forth, forth and back. I was wearing doubles and could check my pressure off of my Cobra. It was the only light down there. Eventually I reached down out of boredom and slapped his side, trying to communicate to head up. He grabbed my hand with a steely grip, and placed it on his wing right beside my other hand. We exited the cave did our safety stop with his eyes still big as saucers. On the surface he blathered about how he had messed up.

Yes, he broke so, so many standards, and put me in real jeopardy that day. It was my first and last trust me dive. He knew he screwed up as soon as I let go of his hand. All that swimming around Cork Rock? He was looking for me, not knowing I was holding on to his wing. Every time I start to get mad at him though, I take a look in the mirror. I accepted his invite to go deeper. I allowed myself to be exposed to danger. On top of that he was a piss-poor instructor.

You can call a dive at any time: in bed, on the boat, in the water, whenever.
For any reason: conditions, buddy issues, illness, I don't wanna!
With no questions asked! I will accept no judgement for me calling a dive. YOU CAN'T MAKE ME DIVE!!!

The flip side of that is just as important to embrace. Good or bad, I have no one but me to blame for my dive. It's important to accept responsibility and avoid that victim mentality.

I'm reminded of a Jimmy Buffett song:
Some people say
that there's a woman to blame,
But I know,
It's my own damn fault!

 

[scottgrizzard]

Agreed, I've seen most dive centres not giving guests five computers egypt, Zanzibar, Oman, Chile. What comes with this is usually poor equipment rental too.

So after a few holidays we decided to buy our own equipment.

I always tell people to buy a computer first, for this reason (unless you need an exposure suit to dive locally...then buy that first, and the computer second).

If I travel anywhere where I maybe possibly could dive, I toss my computer, mask, and booties in my carryon... I am fine with rental everything else.

 

[scottgrizzard]

I think it is fine and safe to trust a DM to handle everything, as long as both you and the DM know you are doing a "trust-me" dive, and the DM is following the guidelines for Supervised Divers (ISO 24801-1... the 2-dive "diet certification" like PADI Scuba Diver).

This means a max depth of 40 feet, within the proper supervision ratios, etc.

The problem I see is divemasters not following these guidelines: going way too deep in less than perfect conditions with far too many divers who all think they are safe and happy.

It is not the way I want to dive when I am on vacation, but I think such "trust-me" diving bears an acceptable level of risk when done according to agency standards.

 

[scottgrizzard]

I think PADI or other agencies should offer an online 'quick refresher' type thing - and not charge $150. Either free or $10-20 and have it be a 15 min course, kind of a commonly forgot things... I mean things like "check your ndl time," and "Don't forget to do your checks before jumping in." None of it is rocket science, but I think even people who've gone a single year or less without diving could forget, yet not need a whole entire 're-activate' cash grab.

A good, free elearning refresher (not as good as a pool one, but still something) is the DAN Prepared Diver elearning (https://dan.diverelearning.com/?courseNo=75).

I recommend it to students when they do my Open Water course.

 

[Cthippo]

I wonder how many of these vacation divers were in fact properly trained, but forgot those skills because they never used them again. Many people can't afford to dive more than once a year on vacation and if you never plan a dive or use a computer you are going to forget how. I will guarantee you there is stuff from my OW I have forgotten because I have never used it, but there is also a lot more I have learned because it was relevant and not covered in the course. There are also things that I never learned because they are not relevant to the diving I do that many would consider fundamental.

For example, I have never launched a DSMB. Not once. Not in training and not on a "real" dive. I have never dove off a live boat where someone needs to be able to find me in the water for pickup, so it has not been something I have ever needed.

 

[johndiver999]

I don't know, that's why I'm asking.
I'm still blown away that they let divers do dives beyond Discover scuba with no instrumentation whatsoever. I would sure hope they have an SPG, but then do they ever look at it or know what the numbers mean or have enough sense to know when they are getting low? I guess a guide is supposed to do that for them, IDK?
This is all new to me, I'm still trying to get caught up with the times of nobody needing to know or do anything, just get lead around and have fun.
Dive and let dive yeah?

Perhaps this thread gives you a new perspective of what might be involved with expanding your urchin collection efforts and what type of (remedial) training might be necessary for prospective participants?

 

[TMHeimer]

I wonder how many of these vacation divers were in fact properly trained, but forgot those skills because they never used them again. Many people can't afford to dive more than once a year on vacation and if you never plan a dive or use a computer you are going to forget how. I will guarantee you there is stuff from my OW I have forgotten because I have never used it, but there is also a lot more I have learned because it was relevant and not covered in the course. There are also things that I never learned because they are not relevant to the diving I do that many would consider fundamental.

For example, I have never launched a DSMB. Not once. Not in training and not on a "real" dive. I have never dove off a live boat where someone needs to be able to find me in the water for pickup, so it has not been something I have ever needed.

I could have gotten certified when living in the sub arctic many years ago. But the result would have been vacationing to dive each summer (was a teacher). Didn't think that was a prudent idea. Could have done a "Discover Dive" on a cruise several years before I was certified. I took the snorkeling tour instead. I would never have considered any diving without having the complete OW certification and got that when we moved to Nova Scotia, where I could dive locally (still do) and keep my skills in shape. I have no sympathy for anyone who does less than that and gets into trouble diving.

 

[MtnDiverColorado]

I would never have considered any diving without having the complete OW certification and got that when we moved to Nova Scotia, where I could dive locally (still do) and keep my skills in shape. I have no sympathy for anyone who does less than that and gets into trouble diving.

I think everyone has had times in their life when they have exercised poor judgement (especially in their youth), and for me personally, there are some dives I wish I could do over.

Reading the accidents forum, I do (and I think most people do) have tremendous sympathy to those are get into trouble diving and their families, and am grateful and have a lot of respect for instructors and other dive professionals who go out of their way to educate and make the sport fun and safe for the vast amount of divers, who dive very casually.

 

[Jafo19D]

Personally, I don't dive without a computer unless it is super shallow and I might not turn it on just to save batteries

Me too! I'm so used to California dive boats where they just describe the dive site and then off you go!

Just got back from Providencia, Colombia, the DC guys insisted on setting up my equipment even though it was my own gear. I was fine with them setting up for the 1st dive of each day because they kept the gear at the shop and it was ready to go when we met the boat each morning, but they also insisted on doing everything during the surface interval. This weekend I'll be diving in Cartagena (Islas del Rosario) and I know they'll try to do the same.