DAN gets attacked by commercial spammer

[pilot fish]

Very inofrmative, nut bubbles. Thanks. Yeah, since there is so much fine print, and confusion, best to have health, trip and dive ins active on every dive trip.

 

[fishhunta]

I did not know that. I had always heard they were very good because they were unbiased and did not have to cater to advertising dollars.

I guess I should clarify that they did one very biased peice that stuck me as poor journalism, so to me they lost alot of credibility. I won't de-rail this thread, so back on topic......Still waiting to see if I should make the switch to diveassure.

I had a DAN claim for a cut on my ankle while diving a wreck. They paid the hospital withtin a month, that is my only personal experience with them....

 

[snow drift]

I have road bulls for years. And never had a problem with any of my many clames. The fact that scuba being a high risk sport and not coverd is retarded. I have loged 150+ dives. And never been injured. Riding bulls is another thing altogether sufering an injuries every time. The only thing that changed from one time to the next is the serverity. Just do the math and you can see that the fact of scuba being high risk.

 

[snow drift]

Any way in contrast scuba VS bulls the amount the insurance company. Will have to pay in claims (which is what thay look at) scuba is a small risk to them. I think that this rumor was started by some one with little man sindrome!!

 

[grouchyturtle]

they are the way they are because there are so many people out there trying to cheat them. In the 20 years that I've been intimately involved with the insurance industry I've seen an immense change in how things are done and see a great correlation with the increase in fraudulent claims.

So for example:
What you're saying is that when someone breaks into my car, I actually would get the full amount for items they stole, instead of some much lower BS figure that the insurance company comes up with. Or I wouldn't have to pay a penny to fix my car after some drunk hits it, in a hit and run, because 0% deductibles would actually be affordable.

If it wasn't for all of the fraudulent claims and frivolous law suits?

You want a LOT, potentially. Some places this could include massive costs which you are somehow expecting other people to bear in the hopes that you will later have the means to pay. All to treat you for an injury resulting from a voluntary action on your part.

Now I'm not exactly waiting for anyone's credit card approval before calling out an ambulance, but in a non-life threatening situation it is not unheard of for providers to insist on proof of payment before initiating treatment.

I don't think so. Really all I want is 2 things.

1: Do everything in your power to get me help ASAP
2: My insurance should cover it, otherwise what the hell am I paying for

If it's not life threatening, by all means, don't follow the same procedures, if there's another way that will save $$$.

As far as voluntary actions:
Maybe it should work more like car insurance? If an accident is the diver's fault (negligent, unsafe, breaking the rules, etc.) they pay, or their premium goes up. Maybe that would get some of the strokes off the boats, of course I bet some of the worst divers we all see aren't insured to begin with?

 

[divematt]

I'm sick and tired of all of the times that I've heard negative things about DAN Insurance not paying for decompression chamber visits without a lot of pressure from dive ops., threats of bad publicity, and the like. I heard about it on the Cozumel board about 6 months ago, and now again here in Undercurrent magazine copied below. Would everyone please tell me where you get your dive insurance? Please don't defend DAN here because I've made up my mind once and for all. I don't care how many people think the world of DAN anymore, I'm only looking for the names of their competitors here so I can change my insurance.

Thanks in advance,
Matt
here's the Undercurrent article...

Recompression Chambers Reject DAN America Insurance: The SSS Recompression chamber network, operator of hyperbaric chambers in a dozen popular dive destinations, has announced that some facilities will no longer accept the Divers Alert Network (DAN) America insurance for payments at some chambers: Nassau, Bahamas; Cabo San Lucas, Merida and Cancun, Mexico. SSS has other chambers, which they say may also stop accepting DAN insurance payments: Cozumel and Playa Del Carmen, Mexico; Ambergris Cay, Belize; the Galapagos Islands, and five in Thailand. In a prepared statement, SSS declared it could "no longer tolerate unpaid services, and since the only insurer in the world who has refused to settle our bills is DAN America, some SSS chambers have no other choice but to ask DAN America patients to pay for services when rendered and file the claims themselves with DAN America." SSS owner Mauricio Moreno told Undercurrent that their chambers are still "duty bound to render services despite a patients' ability to pay." SSS has filed a lawsuit against DAN over the matter.

DAN issued a statement saying: "The dispute involves what constitutes reasonable and customary charges for hyperbaric chamber treatment. Even though some insurers may have signed exclusive arrangements with [SSS] in exchange for lower rates, DAN believes exclusive arrangements are not in the diver's best interest, when the diver needs help at the nearest available chamber to avoid medically unacceptable delays." DAN CEO Dan Orr told Undercurrent that discussions are ongoing and he hopes to work out a solution "that's right for DAN members as well as the industry."

 

[Rick Inman]

I'm sick and tired of all of the times that I've heard negative things about DAN Insurance not paying for decompression chamber visits without a lot of pressure from dive ops., threats of bad publicity, and the like. I heard about it on the Cozumel board about 6 months ago, and now again here in Undercurrent magazine copied below. Would everyone please tell me where you get your dive insurance? Please don't defend DAN here because I've made up my mind once and for all. I don't care how many people think the world of DAN anymore, I'm only looking for the names of their competitors here so I can change my insurance.

Thanks in advance,
Matt
here's the Undercurrent article...

Recompression Chambers Reject DAN America Insurance: The SSS Recompression chamber network, operator of hyperbaric chambers in a dozen popular dive destinations, has announced that some facilities will no longer accept the Divers Alert Network (DAN) America insurance for payments at some chambers: Nassau, Bahamas; Cabo San Lucas, Merida and Cancun, Mexico. SSS has other chambers, which they say may also stop accepting DAN insurance payments: Cozumel and Playa Del Carmen, Mexico; Ambergris Cay, Belize; the Galapagos Islands, and five in Thailand. In a prepared statement, SSS declared it could "no longer tolerate unpaid services, and since the only insurer in the world who has refused to settle our bills is DAN America, some SSS chambers have no other choice but to ask DAN America patients to pay for services when rendered and file the claims themselves with DAN America." SSS owner Mauricio Moreno told Undercurrent that their chambers are still "duty bound to render services despite a patients' ability to pay." SSS has filed a lawsuit against DAN over the matter.

DAN issued a statement saying: "The dispute involves what constitutes reasonable and customary charges for hyperbaric chamber treatment. Even though some insurers may have signed exclusive arrangements with [SSS] in exchange for lower rates, DAN believes exclusive arrangements are not in the diver's best interest, when the diver needs help at the nearest available chamber to avoid medically unacceptable delays." DAN CEO Dan Orr told Undercurrent that discussions are ongoing and he hopes to work out a solution "that's right for DAN members as well as the industry."

Are you looking for an insurance company that will pay more than "reasonable and customary charges for hyperbaric chamber treatment"?

Sorry, don't know of one. But let us all know it you find one that will.

 

[divematt]

Looks like I'm about a week late on this topic as I just noticed by reading the "Basic Scuba Discussion" and this has all been discussed there. I'd like like the names of alternatives if anyone has some anyway.

 

[Divmstr223]

This is no different the your typical Medical Insurance. You go to see the doctor and they charge your insurance company ridiculous expenses for the little service they gave you. I suppose they are within their right to do that, but it's still excessive. Anyhow, I'm sure DAN has received some of the erroneous bills from these places who have Hyperbaric chambers and have disputed some of them.

But what it all boils down to is that the Diver who has the insurance is going to suffer until the dispute is squashed.

Businesses are ruthless when coming after you for $$$, and if they aren't getting it from your insurance (DAN), they will be coming after YOU for it....

 

[StSomewhere]

Do a search, this has been done to death. There is actually better info on this over on TDS.

Why would you want your insurer to pay as much as double what other insurers are being charged? And what makes you think this chamber operator won't do the same thing to whatever dive insurance outfit becomes big. How much do you want your premiums to be?

I hate to defend any insurance agency, but if you have a beef it might just be with the one small chamber operator. Remember that its the "Good Doctor" who runs these three chambers who isn't accepting what DAN pays similar chambers. Not the other way around. Ask why this guy bills difference insurance companies different amounts for the same treatments.

Undercurrent magazine. :lol: