Cost of GUE Fundamentals class?

[piikki]

As for GUE-F pricing, as others have mentioned, it's up to the individual instructor. Cheapest I've seen recently is $500, and the most expensive is $1500 (MX).

I've seen prices vary in that same scale, from $450 to that MX price, mostly between $500-650.

When you compare prices make sure you compare apples to apples. For example that MX course price, at least for what I remember, includes tank rentals, fills (EAN) and I think also site entry fees, if not something else too. Most in US would not. Sometimes a lower price might not include some instructor expenses that you might be expected to pay, so you are better of contacting directly if you want a precise idea.

 

[Gombessa]

Essentials is not the UTD equivalent of Fundamentals. UTD Rec 2 is a much closer (nitrox, SMB deployment, pass/fail, more than two days in the water, etc).

I'm not really familiar with the plethora of "Rec 1/2/3" classes between GUE and UTD, but my understanding is that for each agency, if you're looking to get an "introduction to DIR" as an already-certified diver, Essentials and Fundies teach much of the same things - team diving philosophy, gas management, equipment configuration, buoyancy/trim, the frog/mod-frog/mod-flutter kick, basic 5/6 personal skills, s-drills, descent/ascent. Fundies does include a bit more, but I would imagine Rec 2 presumes Rec 1/Essentials experience beforehand? I also remember some recent reports from the local area describing their Essentials classes as including more than 2 days in the water. Is UTD pushing non-DIR recreational divers towards Rec2?

When you compare prices make sure you compare apples to apples.

I was told third-hand that Cave instruction at ZeroG takes about the same amount of time as Fundies, but costs much more, and there's no shortage of students signing up for Cave 1. So the only way it's worth it for the instructors to teach Fundies is to hike the price up to a point where it's worth teaching over Cave. TIFWIW...

 

[Clammy]

Do it! I need team members later this year! Want to take fundies in SoCal?

 

[Clammy]

I'm not really familiar with the plethora of "Rec 1/2/3" classes between GUE and UTD, but my understanding is that for each agency, if you're looking to get an "introduction to DIR" as an already-certified diver, Essentials and Fundies teach much of the same things - team diving philosophy, gas management, equipment configuration, buoyancy/trim, the frog/mod-frog/mod-flutter kick, basic 5/6 personal skills, s-drills, descent/ascent. Fundies does include a bit more, but I would imagine Rec 2 presumes Rec 1/Essentials experience beforehand? I also remember some recent reports from the local area describing their Essentials classes as including more than 2 days in the water. Is UTD pushing non-DIR recreational divers towards Rec2?



I was told third-hand that Cave instruction at ZeroG takes about the same amount of time as Fundies, but costs much more, and there's no shortage of students signing up for Cave 1. So the only way it's worth it for the instructors to teach Fundies is to hike the price up to a point where it's worth teaching over Cave. TIFWIW...

If you pass fundies, you pass with a rec 1 or if you are REALLY good a tec 1, from what I understand. With UTD essentials, it's basically an evaluation. They tell you what you need to work on and how to do it. You still have to do rec 1. That's what I understand.


The Cave/Fundies thing... that doesn't make sense because eventually you will run out of people to instruct! If they teach fundies too, you're raising a new crop of people that can/may eventually move to cave! Unless it's like balancing an ecosystem. Teach cave until it's unsupportable since there's no one else that can take it, then teach Fundies til you have a huge supply of divers that can potentially get to cave, then switch again thereby creating a fluctuating equilibrium! ha ha!

 

[Rainer]

From a few recent Essentials classes, it seems that they are really a very Fundies-lite course. Compared to Fundies, these Essentials classes have had higher student-to-instructor ratio (4:1 vs. 3:1), limited days of diving (2 vs 3-4), less "team" emphasis (perhaps due to more students, I don't know), don't cover or certify you for nitrox, and SMB deployment isn't listed as a skill.

I think Essentials is possibly a better class if you have had no exposure to DIR diving, but that Rec 2 or Fundamentals is the better entry point if you've been diving with DIR divers, but have yet to seek "official" training. UTD is certainly not pushing non-DIR divers into Rec 2, but it'd be a good place to go if you've already been exposed to DIR.

I'm not really familiar with the plethora of "Rec 1/2/3" classes between GUE and UTD, but my understanding is that for each agency, if you're looking to get an "introduction to DIR" as an already-certified diver, Essentials and Fundies teach much of the same things - team diving philosophy, gas management, equipment configuration, buoyancy/trim, the frog/mod-frog/mod-flutter kick, basic 5/6 personal skills, s-drills, descent/ascent. Fundies does include a bit more, but I would imagine Rec 2 presumes Rec 1/Essentials experience beforehand? I also remember some recent reports from the local area describing their Essentials classes as including more than 2 days in the water. Is UTD pushing non-DIR recreational divers towards Rec2?

 

[Rainer]

Not exactly.

Rec 1 for UTD is just UTD OW. After Essentials, you'd be given a recommendation about where to go next (Rec 2, ItT, Rec 3, etc). All pre-reqs appear to be at the instructor's discretion.

If you pass fundies, you pass with a rec 1 or if you are REALLY good a tec 1, from what I understand. With UTD essentials, it's basically an evaluation. They tell you what you need to work on and how to do it. You still have to do rec 1. That's what I understand.


The Cave/Fundies thing... that doesn't make sense because eventually you will run out of people to instruct! If they teach fundies too, you're raising a new crop of people that can/may eventually move to cave! Unless it's like balancing an ecosystem. Teach cave until it's unsupportable since there's no one else that can take it, then teach Fundies til you have a huge supply of divers that can potentially get to cave, then switch again thereby creating a fluctuating equilibrium! ha ha!

 

[Gombessa]

If you pass fundies, you pass with a rec 1 or if you are REALLY good a tec 1, from what I understand. With UTD essentials, it's basically an evaluation. They tell you what you need to work on and how to do it. You still have to do rec 1. That's what I understand.

Hey there Clammy. Actually, to avoid potential confusion with the names of the "Rec 1/Tech 1" classes offered, what you get at the end of Fundies, if you pass, is either a "recreational pass" or a technical pass." A tech pass is required to take further GUE courses.

Also, UTD Rec 1 is an open water certification course, for NON-certified divers. From what I recall, the next step after Essentials is Rec 2/3 or Intro to Tech.

The Cave/Fundies thing... that doesn't make sense because eventually you will run out of people to instruct!

What you're forgetting is that there are limited locations where you can teach/dive caves. The two biggest locales in North America are Florida and Mexico, so ZeroG has Fundies students from all over the world show up to take cave. And most Mexico cave divers don't actually live in Mexico, they need to (and do) travel long distances to the caves on vacation time. So ZeroG doesn't need to cultivate their own set of padawans, there's plenty of demand being created by all the other Fundies instructors everywhere else in the world.

I think Essentials is possibly a better class if you have had no exposure to DIR diving, but that Rec 2 or Fundamentals is the better entry point if you've been diving with DIR divers, but have yet to seek "official" training. UTD is certainly not pushing non-DIR divers into Rec 2, but it'd be a good place to go if you've already been exposed to DIR.

Thanks again for the info Rainer. From what I'm hearing of the OP, I'd think Essentials would be the right class for him.

 

[Scott L]

If you pass fundies, you pass with a rec 1 or if you are REALLY good a tec 1, from what I understand. With UTD essentials, it's basically an evaluation. They tell you what you need to work on and how to do it. You still have to do rec 1. That's what I understand.


The Cave/Fundies thing... that doesn't make sense because eventually you will run out of people to instruct! If they teach fundies too, you're raising a new crop of people that can/may eventually move to cave! Unless it's like balancing an ecosystem. Teach cave until it's unsupportable since there's no one else that can take it, then teach Fundies til you have a huge supply of divers that can potentially get to cave, then switch again thereby creating a fluctuating equilibrium! ha ha!

That gave me a headache.

 

[Anti-Hero]

Fundies is a great class, and the cost is extremely cheap on a dollar per hour basis. GUE instructors and support staff are some of the best in the business. One thing that really struck a cord with me was: GUE instructors practice what they preach. There is absolutely no "do as I say, not as I do"

For example:

<Other agency> Swim test: Instructors standing outside of pool looking at the clock.
GUE swim test: Instructors in the pool swimming laps right along side you.

For the pool work, we were in a well heated indoor pool, in our thick undergarments, in drysuits, in doubles. It was very hot, and very uncomfortable. The instructors didn't need to be in order to teach us; but they were, all of them, suffering right along side of us.

That for me really showed me how much being a GUE instructor is really a labor of love, not a paycheck. And I'm sure I am not alone when I say they all have my utmost respect and admiration for doing so.


*follow up*
I would have paid 2x as much as I did for what I got out of it.

 

[Clammy]

That gave me a headache.

HA HA HA, It's okay. I wrote that with a headache, I'm just passing it along.


Thanks Gombessa for clarifying! I just want to take the class!! Why is that so hard... =/
Time, teammates, money.. ugh.