Classes still calling "HELP" during training at CSSP

[Sideband]

Any student that would be thrown off by not training with the word "help" will also be thrown off in a real situation because there wasn't an instructor there yelling "this is a drill".

 

[texdiveguy]

I am a DMC in the class that is being discussed, assuming you're talking about the class at the north end near the plane. I was probably one of the people you heard calling for help based on the instructors instructions. I know the lead instructor at the other pavillion next to ours was notified there was a rescue class in progress. If he didn't pass that along to his very large group of people, that isn't our fault. And as stated earlier, it isn't realistic that everyone at the lake will get notified. As a "lowly" DMC, I will leave the philosophies of this discussion to those with more experience. However, as mentioned by Illini Fan, we did follow PADI standards, and Robert's standards by doing it in the proper location. FYI and fair warning, we will be there Sunday doing it again.

THERE IS 'NO REASON' to use the word 'HELP' in Rescue classes!!! Your instructor has made a very poor decision IMO to insist upon his/her assistants in using that word...as a dive PRO myself I would refuse that insistance and not take an active role if those were the cards the instructor want to play by.....I can not tell you as a DMC what your actions should be...but any other call for 'action' word will work for training.

The word HELP is just that----it means HELP ME/US.....and should be reserved for REAL life emergencies, not training.

The word HELP is not a word to be taken lightly....I speak from experience.

 

[jac]

FYI and fair warning, we will be there Sunday doing it again.

there is no easy way to say how bad that practice is without calling you a jerk, so i won't. pass that on to your instructor too.


jac

 

[Paco II]

Just did my Rescue class about two months ago. Regarding the use of the word 'help', my instructor made it clear that we should not use it in the class. As an illustration of why, he used the example of car alarms. They go off for no reason so often, no one evens looks anymore. That should never be allowed to happen with the word 'help.' We should be extra careful so that any time someone hears the word 'help', they always look.

 

[Joe-Diver]

Hey Dartref, I'm in that large group next to yours (wearing the blue doo rag) and we are well aware that your group is doing rescue training. We'll be doing it today also. There's no confusion from our group and as far as I can see, we're the only ones down there this weekend.

I am a DMC in the class that is being discussed, assuming you're talking about the class at the north end near the plane. I was probably one of the people you heard calling for help based on the instructors instructions. I know the lead instructor at the other pavillion next to ours was notified there was a rescue class in progress. If he didn't pass that along to his very large group of people, that isn't our fault. And as stated earlier, it isn't realistic that everyone at the lake will get notified. As a "lowly" DMC, I will leave the philosophies of this discussion to those with more experience. However, as mentioned by Illini Fan, we did follow PADI standards, and Robert's standards by doing it in the proper location. FYI and fair warning, we will be there Sunday doing it again.

 

[Bubble Junky]

I know the lead instructor at the other pavillion next to ours was notified there was a rescue class in progress. If he didn't pass that along to his very large group of people, that isn't our fault.

Yes it is. You can't pass the buck to another instructor from a different group.
Anyhow, there's no need to bellow accross a dive site for help. It just needs abit of pre-thought and plannning. This is why there are seperate scenarios, so they can be broken up to avoid yelling. For example, one scenario is surfacing an unconscious diver, once on the surface the students can just ask the instructor for help, who should be alongside, assessing the students.

 

[D_B]

Hmm , food for thought

We could not do a rescue class without each of us wearing a red hood and were instructed not to wave our arms over our heads when calling for help as we were too far from shore to be easily seen and waving arms would be the most noticeable thing from a crowded beach by the life guards

 

[Mako Mark]

I am a DMC in the class that is being discussed, assuming you're talking about the class at the north end near the plane. I was probably one of the people you heard calling for help based on the instructors instructions. I know the lead instructor at the other pavillion next to ours was notified there was a rescue class in progress. If he didn't pass that along to his very large group of people, that isn't our fault. And as stated earlier, it isn't realistic that everyone at the lake will get notified. As a "lowly" DMC, I will leave the philosophies of this discussion to those with more experience. However, as mentioned by Illini Fan, we did follow PADI standards, and Robert's standards by doing it in the proper location. FYI and fair warning, we will be there Sunday doing it again.

WOW, Kudos for having the Cojones to make this post rather than just lurk Dart.

I dont know the site or the instructor, but I hope you have chance to discuss this first with your instructor in private, and then with the class before your next in water session.

I also reccommend that you direct your instructor to this thread, all in a non confrontational way of course.

Also, simulation is simulation and HELP sould be an instinctive reaction reserved for real emergencies as should the response to it.

Peanuts, Peaches or Pizza is great for simlulation.

I dont think anyone will ever shout peaches when the roof is on fire.

 

[freediver]

I won't argue the finer points of summoning help in an emergency. I do my Rescue diver courses the same as my lifeguard training courses using a lowered voice that is understood by the person next to the student. I'm afraid what we're not doing is giving enough credit to human nature during a crisis event. I find it strange that the most common mistake I have found while teaching CPR/Rescue/Lifeguard courses is forgetting to call 911, however, during an actual event this seems to be the one thing that is remembered when all other skills become vaguely recalled.
I will say that when I am teaching a Rescue course, I have the participant use a lowered voice to summon for assistance for the primary reason of showing me they are in control. After summoning for help (actually a designation to call 911 is used) they continue to request (lowered voice) for: an AED, O2 unit, spine board for removal, etc... Doing this in a lowered tone helps the participant maintain a sense of control over the events. Once they have trained and learned their "script" all they have to do is make it more audible in the real crisis. Once again, give human nature a bit more credit.

 

[Quarrior]

We had a RESCUE class a few years ago at our local quarry. The instructor went around and told everyone not to repsond to yells for help as they were doing the class.


Well, some time later, someone pops the surface and starts yelling for help. People looked over the water, and then went back to whoever they were talking to, thinking this was part of the class....

The person yelling for help was not part of the class and was yelling help for real.

In this case, this instructor could have cost the "real victum" their life.

pretty stupid huh?

Bingo. Exactly the problem.