Cavern dive instructor recommendations

[kensuf]

I would never (nor have I ever seen it) where a new diver or diver with only AOW was told to go take Cavern without an intro to tech course. I don't even think a cavern/cave instructor would take a student who didn't have an intro to tech cert or at least prove that they are relatively stable in the water.

"test your buoyancy, trim and awareness"......test, not teach how to have it in the first place. A cavern course is not the class where you try out your first frog kick.

I recommend Cavern regularly to people that haven't taken Intro to Tech. I also live 30 minutes from one of the most popular cave diving destinations in the world and view Cavern as a safety course for people that are curious about overhead.

 

[CptTightPants21]

I recommend Cavern regularly to people that haven't taken Intro to Tech. I also live 30 minutes from one of the most popular cave diving destinations in the world and view Cavern as a safety course for people that are curious about overhead.

I could see that. I think that has to do with the fact that FL has such an active cave scene. In the NE, no one would be like " hey, go down to florida take cavern and help improve your skills"

---------- Post added September 24th, 2015 at 09:52 AM ----------

Again, speaking as a student, it depends on the goals of the student. And how you define"really solid." Not all divers want to go the Fundies route and yet they want to be better divers. To me, who better to teach to the level of BPT needed in caverns/caves then the cave instructors themselves. Teach the diver correctly from the start so they don't have to unlearn poorly taught techniques by less skilled instructors.

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100% correct.

 

[Peter Guy]

Perhaps the issue here is there can be two very different reasons to take Cavern:

a. First reason -- to enhance one's basic skill level and learn some advanced techniques such as the back kick, doubles shut down, etc. in addition to some line running and a couple of other "cave" skills.

b. Second reason -- to begin the adventure of cave diving where you spend your time working on cave specific skills.

I took Cavern for the second reason.

BTW, I want to believe I was (am?) a pretty good Open Water Scuba instructor but I can't think of a single student I had who was ready to appreciate (for lack of a better word) a Cavern course right out of Open Water. One just needs time in the water, solidifying whatever skills one has learned, before even thinking about getting into the overhead.

 

[uncfnp]

I could see that. I think that has to do with the fact that FL has such an active cave scene. In the NE, no one would be like " hey, go down to florida take cavern and help improve your skills"

Good point. I have the great good fortune to live close enough to the best in the country to have the luxury of taking cave slowly and the resources to tell the instructor to take as much time with me (if they are willing) as needed to make me the best diver I can be. No need for zero to hero for me.

Perhaps the issue here is there can be two very different reasons to take Cavern:

a. First reason -- to enhance one's basic skill level and learn some advanced techniques such as the back kick, doubles shut down, etc. in addition to some line running and a couple of other "cave" skills.

b. Second reason -- to begin the adventure of cave diving where you spend your time working on cave specific skills.

I took Cavern for the second reason.

Yes, exactly. My partner and I are perfect examples. He, no fan of caves or confined spaces, somewhat to my surprise, agreed to take cavern with me. Partly in support of me but also because he knew it would improve his dive techniques, his situational awareness and not mentioned yet, his buddy skills. He and I (and the instructor) knew he would never progress to cave.

I however hoped it would be the beginning of a new adventure in diving and would eventually lead to full cave. And yes, after cavern I was hooked.

 

[ucfdiver]

I AM ALL ABOUT the state parks... But Ginnie has caverns as well and its not THAT beat up. The point was about the limitations not about the cave. My favorite cavern dive was Little River, thought after making the next jump Peacock is now my fav.Tim

Umm, Ginnie's ballroom is beat to snot. Look through the grate and you'll notice that it's a completely different color than the accessable part.

I would never (nor have I ever seen it) where a new diver or diver with only AOW was told to go take Cavern without an intro to tech course. I don't even think a cavern/cave instructor would take a student who didn't have an intro to tech cert or at least prove that they are relatively stable in the water.

Hi, I'm James. Nice to meet you. I took cavern < 1 year after my scuba class with just OW back in 1999. It was with the NACD president and signed off by the training director due to my age at that time. Taking cavern without intro to tech is the norm, not the exception. Everyone in our class was learning the new kicks for the first time in recreational gear. Having seen a much better way to get into overhead diving (intro to tech/fundies first), I'm very much aware that my progression was far from ideal.

I'm not teaching buoyancy, trim or kicks in Cavern. I do that in Open Water class. If you come to me lacking those primary skills, there's no way I can get you ready for Cavern diving in the three days I plan for Cavern class.

How many days is your OW course? My wife took GUE Rec 1 and it introduces the same skills required in Fundies with a different skill level to pass. The Rec 1 course requires 14 dives to graduate, and 40 or more hours of instruction. While I'm all about training like this, it's completely cost prohibitive and definitly not normal.

 

[Hetland]

I took Cavern because I needed a place to dive when the weather was bad, or when the Gulf was closed for business (BP). It was years later, and after ANDP, Trimix, and hundreds of dives, that I decided to take Intro. If I had a chance to do it over, I'd probably do the exact same thing. I've learned much about myself, and about diving in those years. I think I make a better beginner now, than I would have made fresh out of Cavern class.

 

[ldeleon68]

My cave instructor recommended me to take the intro to tech course before taking cavern. With no knowledge of what technical diving was, I did it. Today, I can say it was the right path for me.

The first few dives at Ginnie Springs' Ball Room were not what I expected to be, I could have stopped it there; but, thanks to the new exciting information I had on the technical diving world, I was able to see beyond those dives. Today, I just can't wait to continue exploring new cave system in Florida.

 

[FloridaMan1974]

Hello everyone,

Thanks for all your comments and recommendations.

I wanted to provide an update to where I stand so that individuals asking the same question down the line can have some more information.

I'm currently planning on taking a 6 day intro to sidemount/cavern/cave 1 course with Edd Sorenson. My current plan, assuming I complete this/like cave diving (which I think I will) is to return sometime in the future to take apprentice/full cave with Edd or another instructor( maybe patterson).

My reasons for taking this course/this plan have been previously mentioned by individuals in this thread, so I will go ahead and quote them.

"
First reason -- to enhance one's basic skill level and learn some advanced techniques such as the back kick, doubles shut down, etc. in addition to some line running and a couple of other "cave" skills.

b. Second reason -- to begin the adventure of cave diving where you spend your time working on cave specific skills."

"take the course with two different instructors in order to see two different approaches".

I'm fairly experienced but by no means perfect, while I am proficient with many of the techniques (excluding reel navigation) there is definitely room for improvement, which I hope to achieve with this course.

I will update this thread/my initial post once training is done letting everyone (and future cave diver considerees) how it went, the difficulty level, and any recommendations in terms of preparation.

In terms of preparation anyone have any advice for how I should prepare (aside from working on fundies)? Have a couple months to prep.

 

[uncfnp]

Hello everyone,

Thanks for all your comments and recommendations.

I wanted to provide an update to where I stand so that individuals asking the same question down the line can have some more information.

I'm currently planning on taking a 6 day intro to sidemount/cavern/cave 1 course with Edd Sorenson. My current plan, assuming I complete this/like cave diving (which I think I will) is to return sometime in the future to take apprentice/full cave with Edd or another instructor( maybe patterson).
...//...

In terms of preparation anyone have any advice for how I should prepare (aside from working on fundies)? Have a couple months to prep.

Congrats on your choice of instructor.

Go ahead and get the manuals and read them. As said, work on your kicks, especially frog and helicopter. Know buoyancy and trim but don't get hung up on it. It will change with SM. Same with valve drills. Different with SM. Anything else Edd wants you to know, he will teach you.

And most of all, get yourself into the best physical shape of your life. You are going to work your butt off!

 

[BigTex1836]

You are going to work your butt off!

Amen ! I took Edd as well from intro to SM thru full cave. (broke in to three trips to FL). Great classes and I learned a lot. You definitely get your money's worth and work you butt off. Enjoy your classes.