Big dilemma, should i sell my poseidon rig??

[aquaoren]

I bought me 2 sets of the DS4/ATX50.
And since I'm a lazy *******, I've put H-valves on my single tanks.

 

[StSomewhere]

selling em already. as to my next question, would the black pearl mate well with the ds4/atx50? price not being a factor or would you still get two sets of ds4/atx50's?

No problems mating the black pearl with the DS4/AT50.

If I were to do it all over again, I'd definitely have the DS4 for my first stage. For my second stages I'd still go with a TX50 for my primary (best bubble dispersion) but I'd get an ATX50/ATX40 for the backup (less bulk on your chest due to its much smaller exhaust port).

 

[RTodd]

selling em already. as to my next question, would the black pearl mate well with the ds4/atx50? price not being a factor or would you still get two sets of ds4/atx50's?

Although I wouldn't spend extra money on a reg just to spend it, price isn't a factor for me and the only Apex regs I own are Ds4/ TX 50s. I have six of them, several of which were purchased very recently. It isn't worth the hassle of experimenting with the new shiny ones until they have been around longer. The atx200s have had a few hickups and they do not route as well. As far as a reg being a fashion item, if you dive long enough you won't care about that. So, save the money to put towards more of the correct gear.

 

[Spoon]

Although I wouldn't spend extra money on a reg just to spend it, price isn't a factor for me and the only Apex regs I own are Ds4/ TX 50s. I have six of them, several of which were purchased very recently. It isn't worth the hassle of experimenting with the new shiny ones until they have been around longer. The atx200s have had a few hickups and they do not route as well. As far as a reg being a fashion item, if you dive long enough you won't care about that. So, save the money to put towards more of the correct gear.

in fact my dir instructor has a habit of dissasembling his regs and he mentioned that all models above the atx100 have been tinkered with by aqualung and that the internal components are the same. he already confirmed this with several of the european gue instructors.

so its back to the atx100/ atx40 for secondary for me. second set will be a ds4

 

[padiscubapro]

It may be that you and I don't belong posting in the DIR forum, since adherence to the crede is mandated, but I'll let the true believers attend to the discipline part of the issue...meanwhile, here's what's wrong with Poseiden regulators and why they shouldn't be used, DIR or otherwise:

• Simple is good and Poseiden ain't. There are way too many little parts in their regulators which creates problems.
• Reliable is good and Poseiden ain't. They are hard to tune, harder to keep tuned and, though they don't fall apart, the do break down.
• Cheap is good and Poseiden ain't. They are expensive to purchase and even more expensive to maintain.
• Standardized is good and Poseiden ain't. Special hoses, high IP's, and other "unique" features mean their pieces can't be easily (if at all) replaced or interchanged with "normal" parts.
• Field stripable is good and Poseiden ain't. Disassembly of the second stage needs to be simple and effective.

Strictly speaking, I'm not DIR but I've worked on Poseidens and won't dive them, even though I'm mostly a cold-water diver. Their peak performance is terrific, but otherwise they are a mess. As soon as something goes wrong (and something always does with any mechanical device) you will be paying a huge downside price for a minor improvement in peak performance.

This will be a reg related post.. I'll leave the DIR/Not DIR to others

I don't think you should be posting about poseidons since it is obvious you don't know diddly about them especially the newest regs..

The newest first stages are probably the EASIEST 1st stage I have ever worked on.. The Ip is no higher than any other mainstream reg.. The newer seconds are also very easy to maintain.. The older cyclon regs were also a piece of cake to work on (the jetstream/odin was harder)

As for reliability, if they were correctly maintained and rebuilt they stay in tune and will work until the insides are really really corroded... The problem is that the older 1st stagestoo many people were using counterfit parts to rebuild them and most were not qualified to repair them.. There are tricks to getting the older 1st stages right, and without knowing theses you ruin alot of HP seats...

The x-stream 1sts are super simple and a virtually freeze proof...

I have used just about every brand out there, and I do use APEKS regs as well, but they are one of the weaker regs I have seen when it comes to being able to take abuse..
I have seen IP creep with APEKS regs more than most others... The first stages are fairly simple but the fact is they take longer to service than the new poseidons... I can do a extreme 1st stage in about 5-10 minutes assuming nothing is stuck from corrosion and it doesn't need a long acid bath..

I have apeks regs on my RB (will be switched out for xtreme 1st stages after this season) and I have had both regs blow their HP seats while in use (and rbs use regs very lightly), I have never had it happen on any other reg, also many RB users I know have experienced the same thing.. The Apeks regs do get out of tune easier than most people realize (oc divers wount realize it as quickly as an rb diver - we get lots of leaks (or difficult firing the solenoid) due to creeping IP which an OC diver prevents because they are breathing off the reg)

 

[jonnythan]

I like how you talked so much about the first stages being super simple but didn't really mention the second stages other than to say they stay set where you set them.

 

[Spoon]

This will be a reg related post.. I'll leave the DIR/Not DIR to others

I don't think you should be posting about poseidons since it is obvious you don't know diddly about them especially the newest regs..

The newest first stages are probably the EASIEST 1st stage I have ever worked on.. The Ip is no higher than any other mainstream reg.. The newer seconds are also very easy to maintain.. The older cyclon regs were also a piece of cake to work on (the jetstream/odin was harder)

As for reliability, if they were correctly maintained and rebuilt they stay in tune and will work until the insides are really really corroded... The problem is that the older 1st stagestoo many people were using counterfit parts to rebuild them and most were not qualified to repair them.. There are tricks to getting the older 1st stages right, and without knowing theses you ruin alot of HP seats...

The x-stream 1sts are super simple and a virtually freeze proof...

I have used just about every brand out there, and I do use APEKS regs as well, but they are one of the weaker regs I have seen when it comes to being able to take abuse..
I have seen IP creep with APEKS regs more than most others... The first stages are fairly simple but the fact is they take longer to service than the new poseidons... I can do a extreme 1st stage in about 5-10 minutes assuming nothing is stuck from corrosion and it doesn't need a long acid bath..

I have apeks regs on my RB (will be switched out for xtreme 1st stages after this season) and I have had both regs blow their HP seats while in use (and rbs use regs very lightly), I have never had it happen on any other reg, also many RB users I know have experienced the same thing.. The Apeks regs do get out of tune easier than most people realize (oc divers wount realize it as quickly as an rb diver - we get lots of leaks (or difficult firing the solenoid) due to creeping IP which an OC diver prevents because they are breathing off the reg)

you are the only one who had anything good to say about the poseidon. 9 out of 10 people have told me to sell it. i know its a great reg, hell i bought one but im trying to be dir compliant and by using the poseidon there will be too many unforseen problems in the future. such as availabilty and cost of spare parts, prices of hoses etc. etc. there must be a reason why dir would not recommend its use.

 

[Soggy]

This will be a reg related post.. I'll leave the DIR/Not DIR to others

The main issue with Poseidon regulators is not the 1st stage...it's the 2nd.

 

[globaldiver]

I have used just about every brand out there, and I do use APEKS regs as well, but they are one of the weaker regs I have seen when it comes to being able to take abuse..
I have seen IP creep with APEKS regs more than most others... The first stages are fairly simple but the fact is they take longer to service than the new poseidons... I can do a extreme 1st stage in about 5-10 minutes assuming nothing is stuck from corrosion and it doesn't need a long acid bath..

That is interesting, My experience with Apeks is quite different. I have found them very tough and reliable (I own/have owned double setups of DST, DS4, FST (TX100), & FSR (ATX200) first stages with respective second stages) and have never really had the IP creep you describe. I do however not dive a rebreather and have therefore basically only had pressure on the HP-seat when using the regs.
I did read about one incident with an IP-creep on a FSR-stage, but have not experienced this myself. The DS4s, which is what I mainly use today, are in my opinion rock solid and that is why I use them. I also own but no longer use a double setup of Poseidon Odin, a regulator I like as well but does not fit my current type of diving (GUE).

As for service, I find Apeks very easy to work on. It should not really take a good service technician much longer to service a DS4 than what it takes to service the new poseidon first stage. Apeks has a very simple, and easy to service, construction. The first stages for my Odins are however quite a bit more complicated to service and tune compared to the Apeks (or many other regs for that matter). It takes a skilled technician to make that one "sing"...

Anders

 

[SDAnderson]

I don't think you should be posting about poseidons since it is obvious you don't know diddly about them especially the newest regs..

You may have a point about the newest designs - so far as I know, there is only one shop in the seven county metro-Chicago area that still sells Poseidens and I don't see a lot of them on the bench. As to my knowing "diddly", that is a subjective term that usually carries the added meaning, "I'm pissed off you dumped on my favorite..." and difficult to respond to in a meaningful manner.

A couple of the shops that I've done service work for used to carry them, but getting parts is extremely difficult, perhaps part of the "counterfeit" issue you raised. I suppose I see 20 or 30 units a year, which isn't all that many. The last service manual I got from Poseiden is dated 2003, so I'm not waayyy out of date, however.

I can do a extreme 1st stage in about 5-10 minutes assuming nothing is stuck from corrosion and it doesn't need a long acid bath..

Let's see, servicing any first involves:

• Breaking down the regulator,
• Disassembling and sorting the sub-parts (Some get the acid bath, some get a water-only bath, some get tossed.),
• Cleaning, disinfecting and rinsing the parts,
• Inspecting the new and old parts,
• Lubricating the new parts,
• Re-assembling the sub-parts,
• Re-assembling the regulator,
• Testing and adjusting the regulator.

Less than ten minutes for all this is very impressive, even if you're cutting some non-essential corners and I'd pay money to see it done in five. There might even be a market for a training video...

At any rate, Peace. Like I said, they're great performers (especially at depth, especially in cold water), though expensive to buy, expensive to maintain and (as it relates to this forum) not suitable due to design "issues." If you're buying them at a discount, have access to parts and are working on them yourself, as it would seem you are doing, your perspective would be substantially different than the average diver.