Attitudes Toward DIR Divers

[Lorenzoid]

I pretty much discovered that years ago. I created a brief course (first a workshop, then an approved course) that taught the tech/DIR skills for recreational divers. There turned out to be pretty much no market for it. "Why do I need that?" was the general response.

But many somehow believe they "need" all those other specialty courses. There's a market for Peak Performance Buoyancy, but not a market for a broader "skills workshop" that includes buoyancy and much more?

In my own case, I came to SB and asked what I could do to become a better diver. (The chorus answered "Fundies!") I didn't know what I needed and couldn't quite put my finger on it, but I felt something was lacking. I suppose I could see there were divers who looked like they were more in control and more confident than I felt. Is it really that uncommon for divers to express interest in general "improvement," even if they're not quite sure what that would entail?

 

[boulderjohn]

But many somehow believe they "need" all those other specialty courses. There's a market for Peak Performance Buoyancy, but not a market for a broader "skills workshop" that includes buoyancy and much more?

There really isn't all that much of a market for Peak Performance Buoyancy, either. I was a professional for 20 years and never saw it taught, let alone taught it myself. It's primary existence is on ScubaBoard forums where the people who mock it seem to think it is the first course all OW students take after certification.

 

[Boarderguy]

There really isn't all that much of a market for Peak Performance Buoyancy, either. I was a professional for 20 years and never saw it taught, let alone taught it myself. It's primary existence is on ScubaBoard forums where the people who mock it seem to think it is the first course all OW students take after certification.

It gets taught out here through a few of the padi shops all under the same owner.

 

[crofrog]

LOL. You might want to reconsider giving BoulderJohn input on educational theory!

Why? It should be common ground.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

There really isn't all that much of a market for Peak Performance Buoyancy, either. I was a professional for 20 years and never saw it taught, let alone taught it myself. It's primary existence is on ScubaBoard forums where the people who mock it seem to think it is the first course all OW students take after certification.

I see it being recommended ad nauseum on Facebook, even though the performance requirements are not that much different than what is required in open water.

 

[crofrog]

First of all, it is hard to apply any laws of instruction to people who choose not to take the class in the first place.

Second of all, I was a career educator, and my final professional position was the Executive Director of Curriculum for one of the largest education companies in the world, so I do have some experience with educational theory.

They don’t feel they need it because they don’t believe there is a problem because of the primacy of the ab initio training they received. No one wants to believe they where taught poorly.

 

[crofrog]

I have an idea, why don’t one of you go shop a standard OW class. Sign up and pretend you know nothing, use all of their gear, then do the entire class off the bottom and in perfect trim, keep your mouth shut, let people watch you, let the instructor see you, maybe your pristine skills will rub off? Maybe the instructor might even learn something too?

I did that with my wife. When she got certified I was chastised a few times about not being on my knees for the skills and got into an argument about how much weight I needed wearing 7mm farmers john and had an instructor pull me down trying to prove I didn’t need more weight, he did it without a mask or reg in my mouth and I aspirated a bit of water.

The instructor didn’t understand how to teach tables and lacked some understanding of basic gas dynamics.

Extensive remedial training was required with my wife to correct the poor primacy they instilled.

 

[boulderjohn]

They don’t feel they need it because they don’t believe there is a problem because of the primacy of the ab initio training they received. No one wants to believe they where taught poorly.

Nope. The people who were approached through the promotion of the course were experienced and motivated divers who knew what skills they needed for the diving they did and there experiences told them they didn't need any more than they already had.

 

[tursiops]

I did that with my wife. When she got certified I was chastised a few times about not being on my knees for the skills and got into an argument about how much weight I needed wearing 7mm farmers john and had an instructor pull me down trying to prove I didn’t need more weight, he did it without a mask or reg in my mouth and I aspirated a bit of water.

The instructor didn’t understand how to teach tables and lacked some understanding of basic gas dynamics.

Extensive remedial training was required with my wife to correct the poor primacy they instilled.

Crappy instructor. Are you concluding that all non-GUE instructors are therefore crappy?
What IS your point?

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

I’m not sure if you are aiming this at me or at the group in general, but in principle I do agree with this Eric.

As for everyone here-

I’m going to break my promise and leave this post here in the spirit of keeping this conversation productive. Consider the following question:

How can DIR divers brooch this kind of topic without eliciting such a provoked reaction from others? In what ways can that tendency be overcome?

And no, I am not placing any value in “uhhh just don’t say anything at all” because that’s stupid and you people wouldn’t be here on Scubaboard to have these conversations if you truly believed that (unless you think that only applies to views you agree with). Diving imo is about having open and honest conversations about how to practice it safely and more effectively, which is why I may have had a bit of a strong reaction against some of the earlier posts.

I’m aiming it at the group in general because I know they’re all reading it.
If it was me I’d skip any mention of DIR GUE HOG or any other title monikers that identify the source.
There are ways that could be done within the framework of the recreational world.
It’s a shame, but unfortunately too much damage has been done early on and through out the years to save the name or image of the whole DIR/GUE thing, at least on the internet. In person in the real world might be different, but most peoples’ first exposure to the concept will be online.
You can see for yourself that as soon as you posted this thread you got this sort of reaction, especially from people who were there and took it to heart. That sentiment will never go away until all the bad mojo goes away, and that could be a very long time. I know you’re new, but you have to study the history, and not all of the history is good.
It’s not going to get better with more talking and hashing out, it’s not going to change anything it will just continue the animosity.
Why did you post the thread in the first place?
Like another poster said, why are you picking this scab off?
The very sad part is so much of the animosity has very little to do with the actual diving style and protocols, it has more to do with the divers that were selling it and the attitudes that went along with that.
Happy diving.