Are swim-throughs really caverns?
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lamont
Contributor
we went into some swimthroughs in akumal on a night dive that were at 30-40 fsw and definitely you couldn't quite see the exit from the entrance.
i felt pretty comfortable in those because i had doubles, long hose, 2 backup lights, buddies that i knew could donate, etc. didn't really need a line because we could fit lots of divers into the swimthrough, had lots of lights (10 lights between me and 3 buddies plus the other OW divers) and the bottom was gravelly with zero chance of a siltout.
i was somewhat concerned about what would happen with the other divers if they happened to have an equipment malfunction or OOA right in the middle of one of those.
the idea of just taking any AOW certified divers through swimthroughs like those, or longer, at depths of over 100 fsw pretty much terrifies me. to do those dives, imo, you need to be okay with not having direct access to the surface and being able to solve at least simple problems underwater. CESA is not going to be an option. and in some cases it sounds like you need to be able to donate gas and exit single-file. there have been quite a few reports by relatively new divers in the accidents and incidents forums of near-misses in the swimthroughs around the carribean...
i felt pretty comfortable in those because i had doubles, long hose, 2 backup lights, buddies that i knew could donate, etc. didn't really need a line because we could fit lots of divers into the swimthrough, had lots of lights (10 lights between me and 3 buddies plus the other OW divers) and the bottom was gravelly with zero chance of a siltout.
i was somewhat concerned about what would happen with the other divers if they happened to have an equipment malfunction or OOA right in the middle of one of those.
the idea of just taking any AOW certified divers through swimthroughs like those, or longer, at depths of over 100 fsw pretty much terrifies me. to do those dives, imo, you need to be okay with not having direct access to the surface and being able to solve at least simple problems underwater. CESA is not going to be an option. and in some cases it sounds like you need to be able to donate gas and exit single-file. there have been quite a few reports by relatively new divers in the accidents and incidents forums of near-misses in the swimthroughs around the carribean...
Aspendiver
Guest
A few years back, in Belize, we were led through a swim through. The swim through started at about 65' and ended at 80' depth. It was probably about 40' long, but curved enough so you couldn't see one opening from the other. Thinking back to it now, the scariest part is it was a restriction. Two divers couldn't swim through it next to each other in any configuration. We all just lined up and went through. I tried to get in right behind the DM, but one other diver beat me to it. My concern was a diver in front of me freaking out and stopping, causing a bottle neck. You can fit a lot of divers in a 40' swim through and swimming backwards wouldn't have been fun. Oh yeah, we were all diving AL80s. Not the smartest thing, but I really didn't know any better then.
rainman_02
Contributor
Here's a local example:
Some locals will not enter. Others treat it as a swimthrough. I think it's a personal/dive team choice, but I think Rick's basic guidelines are pretty good.
How would you rate it based on Rick's guidelines? (I don't enter the "swimthrough" until passing through the silt.)
Some locals will not enter. Others treat it as a swimthrough. I think it's a personal/dive team choice, but I think Rick's basic guidelines are pretty good.
How would you rate it based on Rick's guidelines? (I don't enter the "swimthrough" until passing through the silt.)
The (IANTD) definition of a cavern dive is any dive in overhead with LESS than 120ft linear distance to the surface, MORE than that and it´s a cavedive. If you enter a swimthru at 100ft it can´t be more than 40ft long before it becomes a cavedive which is no place to be without the appropriate training and equipment.
I did a few quided caverndives in Mexico where they took aow divers. I spent as much time watching the other divers as keeping track of navigation. I felt that the other divers were at least as big a danger as getting lost.
ymmv
I did a few quided caverndives in Mexico where they took aow divers. I spent as much time watching the other divers as keeping track of navigation. I felt that the other divers were at least as big a danger as getting lost.
ymmv
OP
Thanks, everyone, for the replies.
<< A swimthrough is only a swimthrough (not an overhead) if it meets the following criterea (my definition):
(1) You can see the exit from the entrance, and for the entire swim through the swimthrough.
(2) You can see that there's plenty of room to make the swim without entanglement hazard and without any "squeezes" (restrictions).
(3) The total distance from the entrance to the surface is less than the distance you can perform a CESA; in no case more than 130'. >>
The swim-throughs I have in mind as examples easily fail this test. Trinity Caves (on Grand Cayman) and Mary's Place (on Roatan) don't even come close - they fail all 3 conditions. BTW, Mary's Place is THE signature dive on Roatan and most tourists on a dive vacation are taken through it.
For most plain-vanilla recreational divers, many of the swim-throughs on Grand Cayman's North Wall fail condition #3. The entrance is often at about 70 - 90 feet. In any event, once you are inside the swim-through you will ordinarily have divers ahead and behind you, and there is little room to get past them as you begin your CESA.
As for the IANTD definition, I think Trinity Caves qualifies as a cave and earns its name. There are points in the system where you are more than 120 linear feet from the surface by my estimation.
<< A swimthrough is only a swimthrough (not an overhead) if it meets the following criterea (my definition):
(1) You can see the exit from the entrance, and for the entire swim through the swimthrough.
(2) You can see that there's plenty of room to make the swim without entanglement hazard and without any "squeezes" (restrictions).
(3) The total distance from the entrance to the surface is less than the distance you can perform a CESA; in no case more than 130'. >>
The swim-throughs I have in mind as examples easily fail this test. Trinity Caves (on Grand Cayman) and Mary's Place (on Roatan) don't even come close - they fail all 3 conditions. BTW, Mary's Place is THE signature dive on Roatan and most tourists on a dive vacation are taken through it.
For most plain-vanilla recreational divers, many of the swim-throughs on Grand Cayman's North Wall fail condition #3. The entrance is often at about 70 - 90 feet. In any event, once you are inside the swim-through you will ordinarily have divers ahead and behind you, and there is little room to get past them as you begin your CESA.
As for the IANTD definition, I think Trinity Caves qualifies as a cave and earns its name. There are points in the system where you are more than 120 linear feet from the surface by my estimation.
Wow! :11: That was quite a story, thanks for posting it.
diver 85
Contributor
Have only glanced @ this thread but have 3 quick questions
1) What is Bonnie's Arch dive(off Grand Cayman) considered (2) what is Devil's Throat dive(here I'm meaning when you enter @ 80' & come out @ 125') off Cozumel considered & (3) what is Eden's Rock/Devil's Grotto dive off Grand Cayman(@Georgetown) considered????.....TIA........
EDIT.....here's 2 short videos of Devil's Throat/1st one is entering @ 80', 2nd one is exiting @ 125'
Video of Devil's Throat beginning - Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting
Video of Devil's Throat 2 - Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting
1) What is Bonnie's Arch dive(off Grand Cayman) considered (2) what is Devil's Throat dive(here I'm meaning when you enter @ 80' & come out @ 125') off Cozumel considered & (3) what is Eden's Rock/Devil's Grotto dive off Grand Cayman(@Georgetown) considered????.....TIA........EDIT.....here's 2 short videos of Devil's Throat/1st one is entering @ 80', 2nd one is exiting @ 125'
Video of Devil's Throat beginning - Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting
Video of Devil's Throat 2 - Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting
diver 85
Contributor
This is done every day of the week & twice on Sundays in the Caribbean, how many accidents have you heard of??....so summizing, I would have to think it's very safe...take a look @ my CZM videos, link below, from a couple weeks ago in Devil's Throat(page 3 then page 2--work back to front, I was raised in China, lol)...For one of the diver's, I think it was dive # 20 something for him(he said he had just got certified on the mainland @ the cenotes the week before)...
GEAUXtiger/CZMUWvideoNov07 - Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting
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