Any PADI instructors here who are also DIR compliant?

[boulderjohn]

There is no "standard" mandating that a hover be performed "using a cross legged vertical position". A diver may use any position they like, as long as the standard is met that they "Hover using buoyancy control for at least ______ [insert time frame here, depending on course] without kicking or sculling."

Thus an Instructor or student may hover upside down, sideways, whatever, as long as they demonstrate mastery of the hover by not kicking, sculling, or moving up/down in the water column.

I agree, and I would like to talk about the trim issue for hovering a little.

The shop with which I worked had all OW students using BCD's and weight belts. It is pretty darn tough to hover in horizontal trim with gear like that. I therefore accepted any body position the student felt comfortable using for this part of the class. The key learning is breath control to maintain depth. I focused on swimming in trim during the rest of the class, when students could use their kicking to overcome the fact that their weight is not distributed properly.

PPB is a good time to work on the next step.

Hovering in trim, such as you would be expected to do in a DIR Fundies class, is a pretty high standard for new OW students, especially if they do not have the proper gear for it. I do not require that.

 

[Peter Guy]

Hovering in trim, such as you would be expected to do in a DIR Fundies class, is a pretty high standard for new OW students, especially if they do not have the proper gear for it. I do not require that.

A couple of years ago I was on Maui and decided to do some diving off Molokini. I had not taken my normal gear, but, instead, a traditional BC which had integrated weights. This was a drift dive along a wall and I found myself having a very hard time being "pretty" and horizontal -- and finally I just said Screw It -- HAVE FUN YOU IDIOT -- and let the gear put me in the position it wanted. Since this was a drift dive, I didn't really need to care -- so I ended up cheerfully drifting the dive almost vertical -- but since I was on a wall, what difference did it make?

 

[bluemed]

Although we are talking about configurations and equipment, the biggest difference is NOT equipment related or skill related.
The BIG difference is to be found in Situational awareness, Team diving, sense of Responsibility and decision making.
I am a PADI Master instructor and a UTD instructor, and a working one ;-)
I say this because many UTD or GUE instructors out there have a real job and drive fancy cars ,-), easy to "exclusively dive DIR..
Although I don't teach a lot of PADI anymore, if I do so, I directly start with awareness, teamdiving and making decisions.
I am always on a longhose, wing and BP, if they are NOT I show them the difference in my configuration and explain them the WHY.
Very rewarding, since 99% of the students directly see the advantage of using a longhose.
I directly talk about positioning, the fact that we need to be able to communicate, not just follow "your" Instructor.
For example, from day 1 they ask me for air, just like I ask them.
They are not allowed to touch the bottom also not on DIVE 1.
It comes very natural to students if they dont know any different, the funny thing is that INSTRUCTORS are always looking for excuses why students
should be sitting on the bottom, it is NEVER the student...it is logical NOT to sit on the bottom.
All skills are always evaluated on equipment, team and environment.
The same with the frog kick, in the OWDC I start with that.... again...it is a far better kick than the standard kick, students directly notice that....it is crazy, if you think about it..that there is nothing, ABSOLUTELY nothing about any fin kick in any PADI manual. (something about effective finning techniques in the AOWD manual)
Although many call it over teaching, I want my students to come out on a certain level...they are my business, also if it is on a PADI card.
There is one big downside; the eternal discussions with other instructors, I dont know how many have tried to QA me...;-).
Yes..aah yes..it takes more time, so now instead of 20 minutes, (requiered time PADI), it is 1 hour a dive...

I think that all this is more important than have your students in the exact proper configuration and that they know how to do helicopter turns..
Not so long ago, one of my OW students went for a dive after his course (dive 5), I was on the divesite and I heared the Instructor that guided him saying " "Wahaha..this guy asked me how much air I still had, I told him not to worry..and then he signalled me something..." ;-))
(That signal was the Directional exit).

 

[TSandM]

It is actually amazing what students can master, if they have good visual models and they are not told anything is difficult.

In our last class, in the last pool session, I had students attempting (and some succeeding at) clearing their mask while hovering inside a hula hoop!

We also emphasize "buddyness" (embryonic team skills) and communication in our classes.

It seems as though the most difficult thing to get through to new divers is a good kick of any sort, whether it's flutter, mod flutter, or frog. Everybody wants to flex at the hip joint . . .

 

[DCBC]

Its not so much about staying within standards but more about exceeding the standards to the point where a CD or IT looked at the class and question you "WTF are you doing???" kind of scenario.

A PADI Instructor must teach to PADI Standards and not deviate from the PADI program (although the Instructor can do anything s/he want until they get caught). NAUI allows the Instructor to teach anything (that's consistent with the safety of the Student) over and above the "minimum standards" set by NAUI and in-fact it encourages the Instructor to do so.

I include a requirement for increased in-water skills and include rescue/self-rescue (including submerged rescue) and dive-team procedures for preventing/dealing with emergencies, standardized equipment placement, S-Drills, Valve Drills, Bubble checks and the use of necklaces into my OW program. Emphasis is on buoyancy control, as well as confidence building exercises like station breathing, buddy breathing, blackout drills, harassment and a buoyancy test grid (the gauntlet) which is made out of hoops at different depths (one requiring equipment removal to get through.. which is a lot of fun).

 

[eelnoraa]

never mind. Just realized this section is for Go Pro. Not an instructor, maybe shouldn't comment

 

[TSandM]

Okay, DCBC -- I just reviewed the standards for the GUE OW class. There are two skills in the class which are not required in a PADI OW class -- one is to demonstrate proficiency with a non-silting propulsion technique (actually, two) and the other is SMB deployment. In addition, GUE OW class students essentially do a Nitrox class as part of their academics. All the other skills are required for a PADI OW class, and in fact, the PADI class involves quite a few skills the GUE class doesn't require at all (like a navigation swim). GUE OW students are required to stay within 30 degrees of horizontal while doing all diving activities, and to remain within 5 feet of their target depth.

A PADI instructor can teach in a GUE gear configuration, and his student can also use this gear. He is required to teach an air-sharing ascent, as well as all the other GUE OW skills OTHER THAN non-silting propulsion and bag shooting. There is no prohibition against teaching frog kick or modified flutter in a PADI class; there is no requirement that any degree of proficiency with any kicking style be demonstrated to pass the class.

Modulo the Nitrox and the bag shoot, I could easily see an instructor teaching a PADI OW class that would strongly resemble the GUE OW class (except for the periodic presence of snorkels). A PADI instructor may not, however, require the GUE standard of buoyancy and trim to certify a student.

 

[danvolker]

Although we are talking about configurations and equipment, the biggest difference is NOT equipment related or skill related.
The BIG difference is to be found in Situational awareness, Team diving, sense of Responsibility and decision making.
I am a PADI Master instructor and a UTD instructor, and a working one ;-)
I say this because many UTD or GUE instructors out there have a real job and drive fancy cars ,-), easy to "exclusively dive DIR..
Although I don't teach a lot of PADI anymore, if I do so, I directly start with awareness, teamdiving and making decisions.
I am always on a longhose, wing and BP, if they are NOT I show them the difference in my configuration and explain them the WHY.
Very rewarding, since 99% of the students directly see the advantage of using a longhose.
I directly talk about positioning, the fact that we need to be able to communicate, not just follow "your" Instructor.
For example, from day 1 they ask me for air, just like I ask them.
They are not allowed to touch the bottom also not on DIVE 1.
It comes very natural to students if they dont know any different, the funny thing is that INSTRUCTORS are always looking for excuses why students
should be sitting on the bottom, it is NEVER the student...it is logical NOT to sit on the bottom.
All skills are always evaluated on equipment, team and environment.
The same with the frog kick, in the OWDC I start with that.... again...it is a far better kick than the standard kick, students directly notice that....it is crazy, if you think about it..that there is nothing, ABSOLUTELY nothing about any fin kick in any PADI manual. (something about effective finning techniques in the AOWD manual)
Although many call it over teaching, I want my students to come out on a certain level...they are my business, also if it is on a PADI card.
There is one big downside; the eternal discussions with other instructors, I dont know how many have tried to QA me...;-).
Yes..aah yes..it takes more time, so now instead of 20 minutes, (requiered time PADI), it is 1 hour a dive...

I think that all this is more important than have your students in the exact proper configuration and that they know how to do helicopter turns..
Not so long ago, one of my OW students went for a dive after his course (dive 5), I was on the divesite and I heared the Instructor that guided him saying " "Wahaha..this guy asked me how much air I still had, I told him not to worry..and then he signalled me something..." ;-))
(That signal was the Directional exit).

I like the way PADI has become so accessible to so many people....the worst issues I see are the complete failure to teach buoyancy for many basic OW classes, and the failure to teach that touching the bottom and silting IS BAD...
Here is a fairly typical PADI OW Class at the BHB ( taught by a shop from outside the area--the local shops do NOT allow this )....
This first video has the class come into view 20 seconds in....
[video=youtube_share;dgdabfvr2B0]http://youtu.be/dgdabfvr2B0[/video] Longer but a must see



this video is shorter...and also good at showing a norm that should not be a norm.
[video=youtube_share;LGcGU-I2jK4]http://youtu.be/LGcGU-I2jK4[/video]

 

[pocky21]

I have not taken a GUE/DIR class, and I am not concerned with holding my students to that standard. I do not expect my students to perform demonstration quality skills in perfect trim (although some have surprised me in this regard). My job is not to turn them into skill monkeys, my job is to show them how to stay alive throughout their diving career. I give them a reasonable amount of trust - trust that they will help me help them work through stress before it becomes a problem, trust that they will look after themselves first and their buddy second, and trust that they will use sound judgement before, during, and after their dive. If they break that trust, we go back to the root cause and work it out - not sit in 4' of water and play with each other's octos or push a skill just to "get it done". At the end of class, they have enough of my trust to let them start learning on their own. Gear and skills work together, and they should not be neglected, but both pale in comparison to the importance of good judgement.

 

[tracydr]

Dan-that looks like just about any local class at our lake around here. Really no difference from what I can tell.
Funny little story-friend of mine was letting me try out some of her gear on a busy holiday weekend last summer. We were diving together shoulder to shoulder at the local mud hole, working our way out to the drop off point, in about 15 feet of water, and had to swim past a large OW class. My friend is Cave 1 certified and has nice skills, we were both certainly not looking like new OW students on day one, at least I hope.
Anyway, one of the instructors of this very large class thought we were lost and made a beeline to head us off at the pass.
The visibility really wasn't that bad, at least 10-15 feet. We had a great laugh when he slammed his brakes on and went back to standing with his students in a semi-circle on the bottom.