Advanced Open Water Disappointment

[wetb4igetinthewater]

Too bad. Systemic improvement is unlikely if everybody feels this way.

FIFY.

 

[tursiops]

FIFY.

How do you rationalize this statement with your relentless plea to try for modest improvements?

The truth is that diving instruction could be dramatically improved. And the improvement is probably proportional to the effort/cost involved. How about we set the short term goal as improving things "a little"?

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

How do you rationalize this statement with your relentless plea to try for modest improvements?

Simple. I don't think modest improvements are possible under the existing conditions.

I wish for there to be improvements in scuba just like I wish for world peace. I genuinely want both and believe that efforts should be made. I just know better than to hold my breath.

 

[tursiops]

Simple. I don't think modest improvements are possible under the existing conditions.

I wish for there to be improvements in scuba just like I wish for world peace. I genuinely want both and believe that efforts should be made. I just know better than to hold my breath.

Ok, you can wish for the perfect, I'll go with the good...and both report crap from instructors/shops when I experience it and also encourage others to do the same. You can sit back waiting for the perfect to magically appear, doing nothing, and enjoy the fruits of our efforts.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

Ok, you can wish for the perfect, I'll go with the good...and both report crap from instructors/shops when I experience it and also encourage others to do the same. You can sit back waiting for the perfect to magically appear, doing nothing, and enjoy the fruits of our efforts.

Yeah Mel, I'm not looking for perfect. Please don't twist my words (though you do it often). The reality is such reports will not have any impact. I know of just a small number, and nothing happened. The instructor in question didn't even get a talking to. Keep PADI out of the court room, and you'll be fine.

So now I'm curious. What have YOU done personally to address the shortcomings in the industry?

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

Too bad. Systemic improvement is unlikely if everybody feels this way.

Improvement would likely happen only if the bean counters determine that too much revenue is lost through an action. If profit margins are healthy even with a few loses, they will likely continue with the same course. In other words, if it’s not broken enough to have to deploy resources to fix it, just leave it alone. PADI already has more market share than all the other agencies combined. Why would they be concerned over a small percentage of customer complaints that would cost them way more to fix that just letting those customers be unhappy?

 

[tursiops]

So now I'm curious. What have YOU done personally to address the shortcomings in the industry?

Good question. I've never personally experienced an instructor that needed reporting, so I've had nothing to report. All I've got is hearsay -- from you and others -- and PADI rightfully does not follow up on hearsay. I DO know of one local instructor who was fired by the shop owner for not teaching a PADI specialty to standards. It was a multi-level dive as part of an AOW class that he taught the students to plan on tables using the incorrect procedure of assuming zero SI between levels.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

Good question. I've never personally experienced an instructor that needed reporting, so I've had nothing to report. All I've got is hearsay -- from you and others -- and PADI rightfully does not follow up on hearsay. I DO know of one local instructor who was fired by the shop owner for not teaching a PADI specialty to standards. It was a multi-level dive as part of an AOW class that he taught the students to plan on tables using the incorrect procedure of assuming zero SI between levels.

Well, I and another instructor reported an MI for different issues. But as he was a master instructor/shop owner, and due to a different shop chain converting one of their stores to SSI, the PNW regional rep at the time said over a dinner to the other instructor that "we can do things too" and allowed the MI to become a CD (now inactive).

Now it is hearsay information of friends/acquaintances who have filed complaints to several agencies (not just PADI), but I believe them.

But that isn't what I was getting at. A report doesn't actually do anything. Now if you could provide evidence of what was reported and what action was taken, I'll take that back. I was referring to sharing knowledge in some small way that has at least an impact to one instructor. A positive influence, no matter how small, is still positive.

 

[Forbin's Descent]

Improvement would likely happen only if the bean counters determine that too much revenue is lost through an action. If profit margins are healthy even with a few loses, they will likely continue with the same course. In other words, if it’s not broken enough to have to deploy resources to fix it, just leave it alone. PADI already has more market share than all the other agencies combined. Why would they be concerned over a small percentage of customer complaints that would cost them way more to fix that just letting those customers be unhappy?

This is a great point as well. Equity companies are interested in one thing: equity.

 

[Outbound]

Four instructors myself.

It’s not just me. This is rampant in the industry. That’s why these threads continue to persist.

I'm not sure how rampant it is. But to the extent it exists, it's because people like you gladly take shops up on the offer of paying for the card and not for the training. Not sure why you would do that. You were had.