Chino prison commercial diver training program

[Tigerman]

Yeah, or he just told a funny story that DIDNT really happen - people do that all the time..

 

[mathauck0814]

Lots of folks from outside California seem to think spending Californians' money is a great idea.

 

[Dr. Lecter]

Judging by its fiscal mess, lots of folks from inside California seem to think it is, too

 

[DCBC]

...people who have the same (narrow and simplistic) belief... keeping the majority a little more honest in what are often very narrow and simplified rationalizations for screwing others...

DA you surprise me; you've been so respectful to others in the past. I don't believe that my view has been narrow, simplistic, or simplified and in no way do I feel that my position is "screwing others."

We are each members of Society and I believe that the opinions of everyone should be respected. That is not to say that your opinion is without value, rather that in this case it would appear that it is not the predominant one.

The issue as I see it is:

1. Is training in commercial diving the most beneficial way to spend taxpayers money? Certainly some sort of training program is required and this program (whatever it is) will cost the taxpayer. In choosing how to spend it, I would think it valuable to understand the employment possibilities after the prisioner is released. To me that's just common sense. If the released prisoners have a poor chance of a job, then the vocation choice is likely a poor one.

2. Should specialized vocational training be offered to prisoners gratis (regardless of what this is)? If so, to what extent? Would it be permissible to fund undergraduate and graduate degrees in Literature, for example? Obviously the benefits to the prisoner AND Society must be measured AND provide a measurable benefit to both.

3. How do these benefits reflect upon what programs are available to other law-abiding members of Society? Are free programs available to others and if so, what restrictions/conditions are made? Should conditions to inmates be the same or different to the majority of Society? Why?

Just a few thoughts; and yes I too have a MSc, which I paid for by partial scholarship and saving on my own.

 

[Zen Diving Inc.]

I was just thinking about this thread today and I realized that it is a mute point. Majority/Minority/Society, really doesn't want to change things. The prison system is "Big Business" possibly to big to fail. If there was a magic button that could be pushed that would reform all inmates nationwide, turn them into model citizens so to say. It would be hidden from sight or destroyed immediately. Even if it were to be put to a vote, i'm not sure the american people would back it. Think about all of the jobs tied to the prison system in one form or another. It is designed to perpetuate the cycle. These programs are just a physaud to keep those who strongly believe that people can change and should be rehabilitated at ease. Like we are actually doing anything to change the behavior in people. Behavior problems tend to be linked to ones childhood (not always). If this nation was really concerned with making change then they would start with taking care of there children. Far be it for me to say who has the right to be a parent, unfortunately we all know of someone that probably has no business taking on that responsibility. I know that there are many programs in place for convicts to participate in. I didn't say awesome programs, just an option. Hey you can be a gang member or go to school and get your GED. You can be a violent inmate or you can find some religion that fits your needs. You can spend your time thinking about what you did and how you are going to be a better person or you can plan your next robbery. Its their choice, not ours. If there is a program that works better then others and puts inmates to work at a decent wage then at minimum they should pay back the training period and the cost of their prison stay (during that training) plus interest. If we can make money (not taxes) off putting them back to work that will be the only way to convince others to support it. Yes, I am self centered,(myself and my family are the most important) self thinking (concerned primarily about myself and my family) and narrow minded (tend to deal with whats right in front of me) I know... Still i'm not one to hold a grudge and I don't hate anyone, I do however have a low tolerance for stupidity and believe that all actions have an equal and opposite reaction. Inmates are in prison for a reason, they did something stupid or far worse. I don't feel sorry for them, even if the reason they come back is because I don't support some program. Wether my tax dollars are used in the prison system to rehabilitate or incarcerate any savings from the rehabilitation would be more then likely wasted on something else with out my consent so where is the savings to me? Its not like they are going to ever reduce taxes because of a declining prison population.

 

[dadediver]

Let's extend your chosen point of view to other things involving bad judgement, mistakes, and or misfortune.

1) How about the guy who loves to ride his motor cycle without a helmet. Since he's an irresponsible ****ing moron more concerned with his own slightly enhanced enjoyment of his ride, than he is the social and taxpayer cost of a serious head injury - why should I pay for his uncovered/uninsured medical costs, TBI program, vocational rehabilitation and any long term assistive devices and accommodations. Screw him - he made a choice, he oughta live with it.


The only difference between those views and your view on inmates are in minor details of circumstance and degree of obviousness. If you want to end rehabilitation programs or apply an absurd concept of "fairness", that's fine, but recognize it for what it is, apply it *fairly* across all domains and recognize that you are at heart no better than the inmates you want to punish.

---------- Post Merged at 08:59 AM ---------- Previous Post was at 08:06 AM ----------

This quote perhaps says it a lot more eloquently than I do:

"Then, as we get older, we realize that a world in which we're only thinking about ourselves and not thinking about anybody else, in which we're considering the entire project of developing ourselves as more important than our relationships to other people and making sure that everybody else has opportunity – that that's a pretty narrow vision.​

"

I ride without a helmet. I have auto insurance (to include uninsured motorist) and a health care plan that I pay for also. I also skydive without a helmet, rock climb witout a helmet and SCUBA dive without a pony bottle. None of these acts are against the law nor have I broken any local revised codes. To call me a irresponsible ****ing moron....pffft.

 

[Superlyte27]

I was just thinking about this thread today and I realized that it is a mute point. Majority/Minority/Society, rea

BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!! LOL
It's "moot" point.

Sorry, but I keep running into people who don't know the difference. This is the first time when I felt okay point it out.

---------- Post Merged at 02:06 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 02:01 PM ----------

Not to get this derailed train farther into the field, but I used to own a company that harvested organs for research. We used to hear all the time that motorcycle riders were call donors. And blah blah blah who cares. It really never affected me much. I always wore my helmet, and it didn't bother me if you wore yours or not. And quite honestly it still doesn't.

But two years ago we harvested on a guy who slipped when he stepped up on the tailgate of his pickup truck. He was 28 years old and when he fell his head smacked the pavement. This guy wasn't skate boarding or cycling or motorcycling. He just slipped on the step up to his tailgate and fell less than 2 feet and died.

I've been in several accidents and it's impossible to determine what your head is going to do when some idiot runs a red light and hits your bike (it's happened to me twice). If you can die from a 2' fall. How much more likely will it be to smack your head when someone in a Mercury Grand Marquis runs a red light and hits me at 35mph.

I wear a helmet. It's too simple to save my life from the idiots in the other cars.

Now, back to your regular programming.

 

[koozemani]

If the state/fed wants to fund a vocational program, why not offer it at the end of the prisoner's sentence in fields where there is a recognized shortage. Make it flexible and based solely on society's need. Offer the program for free with the understanding that the recipient will be placed where the need is greatest for a period of 2 years. After which time they will be free to remain in the current position or seek employment elsewhere. This way a need is filled, and the convict is offered a life other than crime. This is done in the real world and military, so why not extend it to the prison system.

This may have been mentioned earlier in the thread, but I can't remember.

 

[Zen Diving Inc.]

BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!! LOL
It's "moot" point.

Sorry, but I keep running into people who don't know the difference. This is the first time when I felt okay (to) point it out.

---------- Post Merged at 02:06 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 02:01 PM ----------

Not to get this derailed train farther into the field, but I used to own a company that harvested organs for research. We used to hear all the time that motorcycle riders were call(ed) donors. And (starting a sentence with And is poor grammar) blah blah blah who cares. It really never affected me much. I always wore my helmet, and it didn't bother me if you wore yours or not. And(poor grammar)quite honestly it still doesn't.

But two years ago we harvested on a guy (suggest rephrasing that) who slipped when he stepped up on the tailgate of his pickup truck. He was 28 years old and when he fell his head smacked the pavement. This guy wasn't skate boarding or cycling or motorcycling.
Consider this: This guy wasn't skate boarding, cycling or motorcycling.
He just slipped on the step up to his tailgate and fell less than 2 feet and died.

I've been in several accidents and it's impossible to determine what your head is going to do, when some idiot runs a red light and hits your bike (it's happened to me twice). If you can die from a 2' fall. How much more likely will it be to smack your head when someone in a Mercury Grand Marquis runs a red light and hits me at 35mph.

I dont know, how likely will "I" be to smack my head when somebody hits you?

I wear a helmet. It's too simple to save my life from the idiots in the other cars.

Consider rephrasing the above comment, I get the meaning even though it reads bad.

Now, back to your regular programming.

I figured since you were so concerned with grammar that you would appreciate the corrections made

"Its a mute point" in the context of the statement previously made. Mute meaning silent, not with out importance. Since Moot means of no importance I chose to you use mute meaning falling on deaf ears. Would you prefer I start using words like pert'near to make you feel more comfortable? LMAO.

 

[gcarter]

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