Wreck Pen.

[rjack321]

Back on topic, PF, you've got a PM. I heartily recommend AG's Wreck 1 (no deco) course. Very line intensive, but very worth it! I can't wait to hit the Yukon in a few weeks!

Darkpup and I compared notes form Wreck1 with AG and my Cave1 class. From a line work perspective they are quite similar.

The biggest difference IMO is that I did 1 cavern and 12 cave dives in Cave1.

Wreck1 has alot of dryland practice and line work in shallow water, but (e.g.) you don't have to do a lost line drill in an actual overhead. Nor a lights out blind exit from the Yukon. They are different beasts, I'm not saying either is better.

But for someone who's cavern/intro cave already, who would need to fly out to CA from FL, I'm not sure there's that much new material there to justify the class. And esp. considering Perrone is looking at getting full cave. So why not just do that locally?

Hence my recommendation to finish full cave then decide if a mentor or different class is needed to gain wreck experience.

 

[Ben_ca]

Here's the class video from Darkpup's and Kevin's class

5thD-X Wreck Class

Caution Video shows penetration :lol:

 

[rjack321]

The divers who died on the SG recently were not wreck (nor cave I think) trained. They were experienced and from an era when wreck training didn't exist. Its not like they were trained poorly they had no formal wreck training at all. Many longtime wreck divers don't, its not unusual. Their deaths aren't relevant to Peronne's educational path.

 

[grazie42]

Let me first qualify this by saying I´m not DIR.

My experience, having taken both full cave and technical wreck and having done some dives is that neither class was redundant, IMO a good instructor will show you things in each class that are specific to that enviroment which makes the course well worth the time and money you spend on it.

If you´re full cave by the time you take your wreck-class, let your instructor know, that way he can just do an "evaluation" and spend time where it benefits you the most. Mentoring would accomplish the same thing but maybe you (like me) like the idea of having a clearly defined "bar" and a point after which you can start "learning" rather than "training"...

ymmv

 

[Gilldiver]

The divers who died on the SG recently were not wreck (nor cave I think) trained. They were experienced and from an era when wreck training didn't exist. Its not like they were trained poorly they had no formal wreck training at all. Many longtime wreck divers don't, its not unusual. Their deaths aren't relevant to Peronne's educational path.

I don't think we can say anything like that yet. At least one of them was reported to have been in his 30's, and if you are in your 30's you were most likely not diving in the bad old 80's when we did this a lot and trained ourselves over years and many, many diffrent wrecks. I would need to have a lot more detailed info on each diver before making any sweeping statements.

Training is only the start, you can have the best training but no experiance. Its like going to the best flight school in the world but never building up the hours in the air.

 

[Jasonmh]

Here's the class video from Darkpup's and Kevin's class

5thD-X Wreck Class

Caution Video shows penetration :lol:

Good video, the "gong" sound and laughter at the very end was funny.

 

[Ben_ca]

I've seen the raw footage.... There was a resounding "Bong" when Jason's tanks hit.... And of course Joe saw it coming....

 

[Walter]

Perrone- you are already cave trained, yes? If so, speaking as someone who does both cave diving and wreck penetration frequently, I can say that the two are not dissimilar enough to warrant a redundant class. What would serve you best in that instance is to get a good mentor.

I used to think that until the time I took a cave instructor on a wreck penetration. He nearly killed himself. There are similarities, but there are also differences.

Perrone, if you can't find a DIR wreck instructor, there's no reason you can't apply DIR principles to the wreck training you take from another wreck instructor.

 

[chickdiver]

I used to think that until the time I took a cave instructor on a wreck penetration. He nearly killed himself. There are similarities, but there are also differences.

Perrone, if you can't find a DIR wreck instructor, there's no reason you can't apply DIR principles to the wreck training you take from another wreck instructor.

All instructors, just like all divers in general, do not have the same benefit of training, common sense and attention to detail. Shameful as it is to say, I suspect that the individual you mention would not have been much better off had they had benefit of a wreck class.

I certainly don't think there is anything wrong with seeking further training, however, I also think that there are many times when the permutation of classes by the "industry" becomes redundant and can waste people's time and resources which can be more efficiently applied elsewhere. Sometimes the simplest solution can be the best.

 

[PerroneFord]

Thanks for the video. Looks like a fun class.

Walter, I agree, I could attempt to apply DIR principles to the training I recieve. I am doing as much of that as I can with cave. But the protocols are just "different" in certain cases. The recent thread about arrow/line protocol was an excellent example.

I think taking the class with AG has merit. That likely won't be the only course I pursue, but right now seems like a good one to take.

I don't see anything wrong with learning new ways of doing things. I'll be auditing an NACD cavern course in a few weeks, and I am sure there will be things that are done a bit differently than in my IANTD course. No biggie. More practice for me, more quality instruction, and maybe I'll flop around in the drysuit and see if i can still dive without corking!

-P