Worsening insurance crisis

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@Subfiend you and I have discussed a touch of this

The diving industry will still be in a worsening insurance crisis. We can have a whole new discussion about the insurance crisis, especially for PADI members, but that is not the purpose of this thread.
But I’d love your take on the worsening crisis.

I only have personal knowledge of V&B many many years ago, and was a true believer that I would be taken care of by Marsh Canada, later Willis Canada before Tuvell, and later still Owl Underwriting.

I’m told that there is a Japanese consortium in the game, and we all know that most of Witherspoon’s customers went to DAN. I’m told that DAN got really big really fast, which is often a recipe for disaster, and that getting insurance next June may be really difficult.

can you bring any insight, especially regarding recent settlements and the taste for consortiums to continue underwriting in-water liability.

please also give an alternative if in-water liability becomes unavailable at any price?
 
definitely following.....
 
I'm in a very weird situation in Croatia.
By law I have to have medical diving insurance, and because I have "professional" certs I have to take DAN pro insurance, that since 2 years ago only covers me while i'm current with a agency and working as a dive pro. And I'm no longer either of those.
So for the last 2 years I'm paying for medical insurance, that is actually liability insurance while being partially covered by the National mandatory medical insurance, and neither of those are covering me fully if I get bent, but my students that I'm not allowed to have are fully covered by both.
 
So you are saying its a bad time to have just passed my LA County Instructor course lol?
 
@Subfiend you and I have discussed a touch of this


But I’d love your take on the worsening crisis.

I only have personal knowledge of V&B many many years ago, and was a true believer that I would be taken care of by Marsh Canada, later Willis Canada before Tuvell, and later still Owl Underwriting.

I’m told that there is a Japanese consortium in the game, and we all know that most of Witherspoon’s customers went to DAN. I’m told that DAN got really big really fast, which is often a recipe for disaster, and that getting insurance next June may be really difficult.

can you bring any insight, especially regarding recent settlements and the taste for consortiums to continue underwriting in-water liability.

please also give an alternative if in-water liability becomes unavailable at any price?
I cannot disclose any information provided as part of an attorney-client relationship, but I can repeat what has been said publicly to those that are listening and my own assessment of where things are now and where they are going.

First, let's do the math. Five years ago, there were four insurance providers for the insurance industry. Now there are two.

Second, the cost of insurance has been climbing, year after year. This is because the insurance companies and their underwriters perceive that the risk of claims, and the cost of defending these claims, are increasing. They see all the information on the amount of claims, settlements and verdicts. This information is provided to them from a variety of sources on a regular basis, and they write the checks when things go wrong. The number of consortiums willing to insure scuba in North America is getting smaller and smaller, faster and faster. When there is a shrinking pool of underwriters available to even consider insuring a particular risk, it is much, much harder to keep this information from being known or shared.

Third, my firm has always tried to keep the cost of defending cases down to a minimum, I have never recommended high settlements (and I don't settle cases very often), and I have never lost a scuba case. This has not helped avoid the worsening insurance crisis. I have heard, anecdotally, that the way my firm controls costs is not universal across the industry. In fact, my firm just replaced a law firm that significantly overestimated the cost and manner of handling a case.

Fourth, professionals in the industry have to recognize the impact being in a declining industry has on insurance companies' willingness to enter the market. According to reliable statistics, there are more people in America that practice tai chi than there are scuba divers. There are more competitive cheerleaders in America than there are scuba divers. If you were an insurance adjuster evaluating whether to insure a particular market, wouldn't you look at the potential pool of customers and then the cost of claims in this market? Are the claims decreasing at the same rate as the number of participants in the activity? Are the number of instructors you will insure increasing or decreasing compared to the number of potential customers, and how are these instructors supposed to compete for new customers in an industry with high financial barriers to entry for new customers? Do the insured professionals cut costs or cut quality?

In my personal and professional opinion, it will take a lot of effort by a lot of professionals in the industry to steer the ship to avoid hitting the iceberg, and I don't see enough of a commitment to do so. There are bright lights in the industry -- a lot of them -- but there are still too many professionals who make excuses, cling to business as usual, are led by liars, and unquestionably believe what they're told. If I were looking for a viable alternative to still earn a living in this industry, I would rent stand up paddle boards.
 
Yikes!

I recall what the late Len Tillem -- a lawyer who once hosted a radio show out of SF -- had said, "The definition of an unnatural act, is an insurance company covering a claim . . ."
 
So what does all this mean for us non instructor, non charter boat owner common divers?
Is the world of diving coming to a crashing halt some how?
I’d say costs to the consumer will definitely rise as businesses try to pass on the cost of insurance and stay afloat. More and more instructors will decide the cost of is too high for them to stay in the business. Dive shops, which already took a hit during the covid pandemic, will have a harder time staying in business. I don’t think the world of diving is going to come to a crashing halt, but I think we will see a correction.

On the other hand, good instructors with a reputation for quality should be able to manage. Poor instructors will have a more difficult time. There may be a withdraw of some international training agencies from the North American market, as well as a pull back by insurance companies. It’s going to be interesting.
 
I’d say costs to the consumer will definitely rise as businesses try to pass on the cost of insurance and stay afloat. More and more instructors will decide the cost of is too high for them to stay in the business. Dive shops, which already took a hit during the covid pandemic, will have a harder time staying in business. I don’t think the world of diving is going to come to a crashing halt, but I think we will see a correction.

On the other hand, good instructors with a reputation for quality should be able to manage. Poor instructors will have a more difficult time. There may be a withdraw of some international training agencies from the North American market, as well as a pull back by insurance companies. It’s going to be interesting.
Well, a reduction in instructors could lead to an absence of instructors and a final collapse. In a sport such as scuba, instructors are mandatory, certifications are by in large mandatory to take part in the sport in any capacity. For all practical purposes no new certified divers means the eventual death of scuba diving. No new certified divers means no new gear sales means a catastrophic industry collapse.
A total catch 22, instructor pay decreasing to the point they can’t do it compounded by soaring insurance costs compounded by less money available for people to spend to enter the sport and we have have a perfect storm.
 
I’d say costs to the consumer will definitely rise as businesses try to pass on the cost of insurance and stay afloat. More and more instructors will decide the cost of is too high for them to stay in the business. Dive shops, which already took a hit during the covid pandemic, will have a harder time staying in business. I don’t think the world of diving is going to come to a crashing halt, but I think we will see a correction.
A correction is certainly needed.
On the other hand, good instructors with a reputation for quality should be able to manage. Poor instructors will have a more difficult time. There may be a withdraw of some international training agencies from the North American market, as well as a pull back by insurance companies. It’s going to be interesting.
I think this is true for the quality instructor that charges more, as they target a demographic that is willing to invest more for proper training. These customers, fewer in number than the bucket listers, provide more revenue per person. They get what they pay for. I would guess these instructors won't be affected too much by passing on the increased insurance costs to their customers.

I wonder what portion of divers considering to become instructors are aware of the increasing price of insurance. I guess it depends on how much they participate in social media. Today instructors are a dime a dozen for mills. If they quit teaching for a dive shop that is a mill, they are replaced before they even exit the building.

Will this choke the number of dime a dozen instructors that are created each year in the US? We will have to wait and see. It depends on how many of them inform themselves. I don't think that is a bad thing. I would like to see the industry be forced to provide RAID-like instructors out of the gate. This isn't rocket science after all. It's just diving.
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/teric/

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