Why is DIR controversial?

[amascuba]

You three are all elitist buttheads. How dare you insinuate that my way of being a jerk is somehow less meaningful than your method of being a jerk. How dare you tink that only your way of being a jerk is recognizable. I am offended.

Get Bent! hehe .. I'm the jerk on this board.

 

[cmalinowski]

My phrase "typical of a lot, but not all"

Have you not heard references to 'open water strokes' applied to divers choosing jacket bcds and non-DIR equipment? East and West?

I don't think it is life's greatest problem, but do sense an attitude of elitism. See p. 67 DIR: Fundamentals of Better Diving: "In contrast to sloppy-fitting jacket-style BCs...", and "...a classic style open water BC is not only necessarily bulky and loose fitting, it also tends to force a diver's feet into a downward angle, a terrible swimming position...

Are you arguing that feet at a downward angle is not a terrible swimming position?

 

[amascuba]

All the nay-sayer's on this thread should come to my house tomorrow and I'll give a presentation on DIR and serve everybody some free kool-aid.

 

[cmalinowski]

The term 'stroke' refers to a diver with unsafe diving practices.

You know, like jacket bc people

 

[*Floater*]

I doubt I'd mind if someone came over to give me advice on my gear. Either I'd learn something new, or I'd get a kick out of it if they started telling me how I would strangle myself with the longhose or how Scuba Diving Magazine tests show that split fins are superior to my jets...

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I doubt I'd mind if someone came over to give me advice on my gear. Either I'd learn something new, or I'd get a kick out of it if they started telling me how I would strangle myself with the longhose or how Scuba Diving Magazine tests show that split fins are superior to my jets...

Well, that's very close to the advice TSandM got at the local dive park recently from a well-meaning diver ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[in_cavediver]

Some of the comments in this thread just floor me ...

Went out on a boat dive with a bunch of friends yesterday ... most of 'em have some level of GUE traininig ... up through level 2 Tech and Cave classes. Some ... like my dive buddy ... have no interest in ever taking a DIR class. We had a blast, and everybody was really friendly to everybody else.

I just finished reading this e-mail from one of the DIR guys to the trip organizer ...


Gee ... he got off looking at critters and having fun ... even sharing a boat with non-DIR divers! What a revelation.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

Bob,

As usual a nice, thought out post. That said, my personal expierence is not the norm.

Back several years ago when I did my full cave training, I ran into a group taking Cave 1 or 2 (don't recall) in N FL. Don't know fully if it was just those three or what but the crap I was given based on my prior IANTD training and NACD training and specific references to GI3 rambles left a bitter taste. (hearing 'farm animal stupid' amoung other things in the same sentence with respect to friends of your dive instructor does that). At this point, I don't recall the exact wordings but some of which was quoted directly from GI3's ramblings and its really not important, its just history that shaped my personal perceptions.

The funny thing is, many years later, I have developed a respect for some of the 'internet' DIR folks. (not all mind you). I have had discussions regarding gear/protocols and they were very civil.(in PM's), even acklowedging that I was just as safe a diver as they even though our systems where a bit different. Other's, well, a bit more civility would help.

Best idea in this whole thread, get rid of these terms DIR, stroke, kool-aid etc and lose the historical baggage. GI3 was in my opinion one of the worst things for the GUE image and a causal factor for this constroversy today. (at least, my perceptions had were influenced quite a bit by this)

GUE training, really, isn't all that different from the other 'reputable' technical training available and really could stand to 'fit in' a little more. IE, do you differeniate between and IANTD advanced trimix diver and a TDI advanced trimix diver like you do between the GUE tec 3 (or appropriate) and the IANTD/TDI/NAUI advanced trimix diver? (at least on the internet)This, I believe can be done by adjusting a few attitudes and conciously trying to remove the history. If I understand the GUE ideals/goals, this can happen without changing any of the standards, philosophies or ideals for thier training.

In the end, the smart divers will choose their own 'teams' when they do complex dives anyway. In reality, cert agency doesn't make the biggest factor in choosing my dive buddies - skill, attitude and expierence do.

Perhaps one day I will again meet real live true DIR divers that aren't jerks. (I have only met three that I know of, back in 2002 and as I look back, they really were jerks)

 

[Bill51]

Some of the comments in this thread just floor me ...

Went out on a boat dive with a bunch of friends yesterday ... most of 'em have some level of GUE traininig ... up through level 2 Tech and Cave classes. Some ... like my dive buddy ... have no interest in ever taking a DIR class. We had a blast, and everybody was really friendly to everybody else.

I just finished reading this e-mail from one of the DIR guys to the trip organizer ...


Gee ... he got off looking at critters and having fun ... even sharing a boat with non-DIR divers! What a revelation.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

I want to dive with you guys – if I can wear an old Garcia tie die wetsuit.

 

[ShallowDiverDave]

Hmmmm .... 0 to 24 dives and you're already solo diving?

Maybe his concern has less to do with DIR than it does the fact that, as your OW instructor he failed to impress upon you that maybe you should get a little experience before heading off underwater by yourself.

Did you get any solo training first?

Personally, I'd be a little concerned for any student of mine who decided to go solo with so little experience.

Probably has nothing to do with DIR ... he's probably worried that you'll hurt yourself and blame it on "poor instruction".

As for the rest of this thread ... haven't y'all got better things to argue about than a marketing slogan? I mean, isn't American Idol on or something ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

Bob,

Thanks for the comments. The more I think about it, what you have said is probably true, with regards to my instructor.

I knew the day would come when someone would actively question my decision to turn solo so early. I very much understand the concern an experienced diver would have about my decision. The simple response from me is that I’m very very different from any other diver. Yes I am currently diving solo, but I have limited the profiles tremendously. I’m not going to explain all the details here, because I don’t feel the need to justify it given that I knowingly understand the risks, and perhaps most importantly I’m an extremely cautious and logical person. In brief, I haven’t and don’t plan to dive solo below 30 ft for hundreds of dives, so that I can gain the experience while minimizing the risk to what I believe is right for me. I have spent many hours in my life beneath the surface at such depths without scuba equipment (free diving), and am therefore extremely confident in the water. I know you were not asking me to justify my situation, but I figured I would satisfy any curious minds.

--
David

 

[Soggy]

The simple response from me is that I’m very very different from any other diver.

Really? You're unique amongst divers....mmmhmmm.