Why I have decided to stop shopping for ANYTHING at the LDS

[TomP]

In high-volume locations like south Florida, the solution is obvious ... there are already successful businesses like Fill Express who only do gas fills. But what about the mid- to low-volume areas (like most of the rest of the world) where such a business wouldn't have sufficient volume to be viable?

Okay, I thought the basic premise is that fills are being done at a loss, the more fills the bigger the loss. In that case wouldn't Fill Express just run out cash faster in a high volume location?

 

[PhotoTJ]

It is a simple known fact that 95% of them overcharge for services, trips and gear.

K

So you know the profit margins and operating costs for every LDS and every piece of gear, service, and travel, and can state that not 94 or 96, but 95% over charge? Sure.

 

[Corigan]

So before y'all agree to put your LDS out of business, do give some consideration to the rest of the story ... namely that somehow you're gonna have to get those tanks filled up before you can take them out for a dive.

I'm sick of the scare tactics. First certain LDS' try the "I'm not making any money off of this" trip. Then they try the loyalty guilt trip. Now it's the "Where are you going to get your fills" trip. Give me a break. I know 5 different people with filling/mixing stations in their garages. I also know many firestations with PSD teams to get fills. You could close down every store in my area and I would still get my gas.

Why can we not have a civil conversation about LDS' without having to resort to scare tactics to get people to come into the stores? I've bought quite a bit through my LDS' (about 85% of my gear), because they are good LDS' and I like going to them. If I was in a town that had nothing but a crummy lowlife LDS owner that tries every scare tactic/lowly method in the book to get me in the store, I would have no problems letting them go out of buisness. Even if it would "gasp" mean I would have to find air fills elsewhere.

Scare tactics/guilt trips wouldn't be neccesary if buisness models were changed. I have 2 different stores in my area that I won't step foot into because of these various tactics to get people into their store. Their compressors can go bye-bye and I wouldn't blink an eye. If LDS owners are going to try to use scare tactics, maybe they should keep repeating one that would actually have some impact. Reading 8x's in this thread "You better think where you are going to get airfills" has done nothing but make me think of how I could (successfully) deal without a local dive store.

Matt

 

[pants!]

I know 5 different people with filling/mixing stations in their garages. I also know many firestations with PSD teams to get fills. You could close down every store in my area and I would still get my gas.

Dang.... I wish I were that lucky. The only place I can get nitrox within about 2 hours of my house are two dive shops..

 

[PhotoTJ]

http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cach...s+e-commerce+site+cost&hl=en&client=firefox-a

You guys are still missing the fact that Scubatoys and Leisurepro have all the expenses of your typical LDS plus the expense of running an enterprise e-commerce site.

No they don't. No compressor, no rental gear, no fixtures, less rent. (Check industrial rents vs. Commercial.)

 

[GrierHPharmD]

Local sporting goods stores might be well advised to get in on the action.

Oshman's, The Sports Authority, Dick's, etc... many of them do CO2 fills for paintball behind the hunting counter. It would be a drop in the bucket to many of these big box stores to put a compressor and nitrox stick in the back next to the ski tuning shop or CO2 bank or whatever and charge $5 for air and $14 for nitrox and be done with it.

Put a bulletin board with local instructors' phone numbers right next to it, and maybe have a few sets of rental gear if they want to really get into it.

They don't need to have an entire SCUBA section, and the LDS would suddenly become kinda obsolete.

Interesting idea. I could see BassPro moving in that direction.

The point is that most of us have had unpleasant experiences with LDS's at some point or other. Like the local one in Charlotte whose owner consistently gives out incorrect information to push unwanted items. Or the one in Ft. Lauderdale whose owner tried to push an unwanted pair of FREEDIVING FINS on me when I went in for a nitrox fill! Ridiculously inept sales strategies are not unique to dive shops, but are unfortunately all too common.

I deal with three local shops. I buy almost all of my gear locally, though I buy some ancillary supplies online. I never hide the fact that I shop around. At the same time, I try to say nice things about each shop and their lines when there are customers present and have helped close quite a few deals from time to time for them. I refer new divers to the shops I use, depending on their individual needs (location, product lines, etc.)

I guess I just think that it's time for LDS owners to stop approaching us as if we owed them something to use their shops. Sell me gear at a reasonable price and we'll both win. The relationship will come naturally. Gouge me or guilt me, and you'll lose a good customer. Do that with enough customers, and you'll be out of business. And as long as there's a need for gear and fills, somebody will step in and take your place.

Taking care of your customers and making the shopping experience pleasant are just basic business functions. It's apalling how many LDS owners fail on those counts...

 

[Corigan]

Dang.... I wish I were that lucky. The only place I can get nitrox within about 2 hours of my house are two dive shops..

Yeah, I know some don't have the oppurtunities like I have. If worst came to worst and I was in a town where I didn't have many options for fills I would work on building my own fill station. I have already been looking into the logistics of doing just that here in my home, even with all the fill station options around me.

Luckily I have a good LDS near me, that does great buisness. It is always full of customers. They aren't going anywhere anytime soon, as they understand that scare tactics don't work. They don't put me on a guilt trip when I walk into their store with a piece of gear I didn't buy there. They don't tell me how rough times are like some of the LDS owners around here. They don't tell me they aren't making money off this.

I think some LDS' are just destined to fail miserably. Unfortunately those that have failed have put a bad taste in some peoples mouths. It's all too common. You can find the same crappy buisness model in just about every town.

Matt

 

[Corigan]

I guess I just think that it's time for LDS owners to stop approaching us as if we owed them something to use their shops. Sell me gear at a reasonable price and we'll both win. The relationship will come naturally. Gouge me or guilt me, and you'll lose a good customer. Do that with enough customers, and you'll be out of business. And as long as there's a need for gear and fills, somebody will step in and take your place.

Taking care of your customers and making the shopping experience pleasant are just basic business functions. It's apalling how many LDS owners fail on those counts...

Ding ding, we have a winner. Well said. I've been gouged, guilted, you name it. I used to come home from my one local dive shop with headaches.

Matt

 

[pants!]

No they don't. No compressor, no rental gear, no fixtures, less rent. (Check industrial rents vs. Commercial.)

Let me interject and point out that you may want to check out the Scubatoys web site before you make that claim again.

I'm not sure about Leisurepro.. I dunno if they have a compressor, but they certainly do have a commercial storefront in Manhattan with fixtures and the whole bit.

 

[teknitroxdiver]

No they don't. No compressor, no rental gear, no fixtures, less rent. (Check industrial rents vs. Commercial.)

What? I suppose that when ScubaToy's built that 10,000 sq foot shop they didn't put in a compressor, or any fixtures, and they sure wouldn't want any rental gear.

Here's a hint about what I'm talking about: http://scubatoys.com/poolcam/poolcam.asp