Why do you dismiss DIR?

[nordicdiver]

Dear Lost Yooper

I don't think most divers dismiss DIR, After all it is a style.!

And it works well for some. What they seem to dismiss is other
divers acting like it is the only way to dive!

I myself have over 20 years of deep wreck diving experiance &
use some DIR in my own diving, But not all of it.

DIR in it self is not the problem, I believe the problems run much
deeper then how you wear your gear.

Many divers simply don't care for being called a stroke & told if
you do not dive DIR, You will come home in a body bag.

This atatude comes from the very top of GUE & that is the type
of comments that only will hurt technical diving.!!!

Dive Safe Nordic Diver

 

[Mossback]

Warren,

I certainly hold no grudge and am more than willing to let this exchange be water under the bridge.

I don't consider myself to be a newbie as I've been diving a rather long time. On the other hand, I am new to this board and I encountered a term with which I was not familiar. Being eternally curious, especially where diving is concerned, I have tried to learn more about the topic. I will continue to search for information on this topic and others.

I do not understand why you became angry with me. I have not attacked DIR, I have only tried to understand what it entails. Lost Yooper asked people to detail why they did not accept DIR. In doing so he was basically asking for people to cover the same points I asked him to cover and then to refute them. I still don't see why it's OK for a person who's rejected DIR to list the points while it's not OK for someone who embraces DIR to do so.

I hope we can have interesting discussions in the future without resorting to insults.

Mossback

 

[AquaTec]

Jim
I am wiling to stand up and state my background
Even though I don't pretend to be as teacher here I am one of the learners.

My qualifications can be found at the link below, this is part of my web site. Because you should know who is teaching something
http://www.scubadivingbc.com/qualifications.htm

Since the web page was put on the site a few changes have been made

Fire Department;
President of the Association
Auto Extrication Team Captain

Scuba Diving
DSTAT – Advanced Gas Blender
IANTD – Nitrox, Advanced Nitrox Instructor
TDI – Nitrox, Advanced Nitrox, Deco Procedures Instructor
TDI - Nitrox, Advanced Nitrox, Deco Procedures Instructor Trainer
SDI – Instructor Trainer at all levels
CPR / 1sst Aid instructor

My personal diving
I have over 1000 dives in my logbook, I don’t think that dives while teaching or taking a course count as logged dives; I also only log dives that have something memorable about them. So you could say that there are many more unlogged dives
I started diving at the age of 9 now I am 41, I was taught by my father who was a US Navy diver during Vietnam. We dove by Navy standards for many years
Worked as a PADI Dive Master in Hawaii and BC Canada for ten years
My first job was filling scuba tanks and doing hydrostatic testing
For five years I did trips out to Molokini Island 6 dives a day for work then fun diving after that.
Regularly conducted Air dives deeper than 200 feet [record is 240] prior to Trimix becoming the gas of choice, not to mention Lava Tubes, Blow Holes, and tiger sharks.
Since Christmas I have conducted 4 dives deeper than 300 fsw yet maybe only 10 in my lifetime. My deepest dive is 350ft. I am at about 10 dives for the year so far
I am a team member of the Canadian National Free Diving Team’s Safety Divers
I teach diving in the summer PADI OWD through the Technical courses stated above
I volunteer one Sunday a month to teach kids between the ages of 8 and 12 to scuba dive
In the last five years my dive per year average is between 50 & 100 dives per year [depending how good the skiing is]
I volunteer as a Public Safety Diver for SAR and the Fire Department. I have been the lead diver in two unfortunate situations that I will not go into here.


I AM A SPONGE FOR YOUR KNOWLEDGE

 

[jimholcomb]

Originally posted by Mossback
Jet,

Thanks for the link. It has helpful information.

According to your link:

The DIR System is comprised of three things:

1. What they call a unified team.

They stress divers must tell the team when dives are beyond their ability or when their level of comfort has been exceeded. This appears to be no more than the SOP through out the diving world that anyone can abort a dive at any time for any reason.
Next they say "one learns through challenge." and "DIR dive teams are always looking to improve their dive skills by challenging the limit of their abilities and opening themselves to new knowledge." This is what we've been doing for years, pushing the envelope a tad farther.

2. Next is "enhanced pre-dive preparation"

This seems to be a lifestyle focus which prepares you for diving in general. They say it "involves three essential components: mental focus, physical fitness and diving experience." This doesn't seem to be different from what many of have been doing for decades. It does seem to ignore dive planning for the specific dive. With this life focus, I'll assume that was an oversite of the web site rather than the system.

3. Finally they come to DIR equipment configuration.

They start with an interesting statement, "The most common misconception is that one part of the system can be adopted, such as the equipment configuration, and others can be ignored, such as the team-centered approach or physical fitness."

The actual equipment configuration does not seem very complicated to me. In fact, the website stresses it's simplicity. "Equipment that does not enrich the dive is considered a liability and should be left at home."

According to the website it is simply:

"A rigid backplate (aluminum or stainless steel) with a one-piece, webbed harness, a back-mounted buoyancy compensator for streamlined movement and horizontal posture, a short reserve hose that hangs around the neck for easy retrieval and a long hose (5-7 ft. or 1.5-2 m) that can run under a hip-mounted light canister (or under the arm with a 5 ft. or 1.5 m hose). While there are numerous important details in the DIR system, this simple configuration is the foundation of DIR."

Nothing new here either. What's the fuss about?

Doesn't seem to be all that long or complicated to me. Is there more that isn't on the website?

Mossback

The diveplanning for the specific dive falls into your "enhanced predive procedures".

"Nothing new here, either". You are correct.

"What's the fuss about?" Now, THAT is the question that haunts humanity to this day!! What exactly IS the fuss about?????

 

[AquaTec]

Mossback
You did well with putting the info out there for all to see, and you are right it is not a giant step to be DIR as far as gear style or philosophy.
Hence your easy comparisons.

The "fuss" I see is that there seems to be this fence
You are DIR or you are not, [you are never sort of pregnant]
Not that anybody really cares what side of the fence you are on, The DIR advocates are just trying to inform you that the grass is greener on their side.

Yes there are people like Warren within the DIR system as there are within any system IANTD, TDI, etc. [It does appear that the higher up the ladder you go in GUE the more warrens you will come across, I don't know any of them so that statement is pure hearsay]

I am personally finding some of their advanced theories very interesting, and the part I like about their theories, unlike some, theirs are proven with hundreds of dives, fine-tuned, and then talked about. Also the people making up the procedures and protocols seem to be available for questions via boards like this. [Not that I have tried, but others here have]

 

[Lost Yooper]

Boy, I'm gone for a couple days and look what I've missed! Ya'll need to relax. None of this diving stuff is worth getting worked up over -- jeesh. Believe it or not, it is possible to have DIR discussions without resorting to unfriendly dialog.

I'm so far behind on this one I don't think I'll even try to catch up. I guess if nobody has anything to add in regards to why they choose not to dive DIR, even though they know all about it, then I think this one is coming to a close. If anyone has a specific question for me, just send me a PM or start another thread, I guess.

This was a good one, eh?

Mike

 

[VTWarrenG]

Yes, Mike, this was a good one.

It reinforced the fact that the main reason many people don't dive DIR is that they don't like "distateful" people like myself.

- Warren

 

[Uncle Pug]

Originally posted by Lost Yooper
Boy, I'm gone for a couple days and look what I've missed!

If you would have hung around we could have edicated ya a little

 

[Uncle Pug]

Originally posted by VTWarrenG
they don't like "distateful" people like myself.

There , there Warren :alright:

:whack:
If you dish it out you have to eat it.


But we still love you.... sorta

 

[Lost Yooper]

Don't sweat it Warren. I've been known to get worked over nuttin' in the past. Sometimes, we all just have a bad day or something and find it coming out as we type. Been there, done that and it may happen again sometime down the road. For the time being, I'm ready to get back into Scuba Board and do some arguing (I mean discussing )

Ain't nothing like a "lively" discussion .

Mike