What to do in the event that...

[fjpatrum]

Lynne answered the question before I could, but my advice is that if you haven't experienced what a free-flow can do to your ability to think straight, go down and induce one sometime and see how easily you can make a controlled ascent while you're breathing off a reg in full free-flow. At best, it's distracting. At worst, you won't be able to see or think straight with all noise and bubbles in your face.

I've experienced quite a few free-flows over the years ... never had one induced by two divers sharing air.

For divers who perhaps have little practice at making free-ascents, it's best to do it "by the book", which is to do what you practiced in your training. In this case, that would be a shared-air ascent.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

Okay, Bob; in my inexperience, the only way I know to "induce a free-flow" is to turn my reg "upside down" so the mouthpiece just spews upward. Is there some other way to do this so I can practice this skill? I've only had one mild "free-flow" that was easily fixed by banging on my reg.

Thank you for being such a voice of reason and fount of knowledge for us newbs.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Okay, Bob; in my inexperience, the only way I know to "induce a free-flow" is to turn my reg "upside down" so the mouthpiece just spews upward. Is there some other way to do this so I can practice this skill? I've only had one mild "free-flow" that was easily fixed by banging on my reg.

Thank you for being such a voice of reason and fount of knowledge for us newbs.

If you're diving in reasonably cold water it's easy to induce a free-flow. Just hit the purge button, count to 10, and let go ... chances are very good it'll just keep free-flowing. If your second stage has an adjustment knob, open it completely first.

Make sure you do this at a shallow depth ... and with a ready source of alternate air available ... because you might not be able to make it stop without either shutting off the valve or emptying the tank ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[fjpatrum]

I'm new. I recently "built" my own wing out of an old horse collar. I inspected everything, patched some areas with new material and went diving this past weekend to test the rig. About 15 minutes into my dive, my wing simply wouldn't hold air. I don't generally keep very much air in my BC anyway since I don't go very deep, but this was obviously not "normal." I continued my dive and we ascended to a point where I don't need any air. (I was "leading" so I basically just ascended up to about 25 feet or so.)

No big deal, really, since I was in no danger and can easily swim up my rig and weights. After my dive I inspected my wing and found my OPV (dump valve on my hip) had ripped completely out of the wing. The old horse collar material had deteriorated inside the OPV and I couldn't tell from my inspection of it (it was more brittle there because of glue, I suspect). I'm replacing it this weekend with some new material and all will be well.

The only things I know to do in this situation are a) ascend to a point where I don't need air in my BC, or b) drop some weight if I intend to stay deep--- this being bad choice upon ascent, and c) keep things as they are and constantly move in order to maintain choice depth.

Do any of the more experienced divers have other options to consider in this situation?

 

[dwhthediver]

Bob, that's a beautiful post. I think one of the things we don't do enough of is get students to THINK about what might happen during a dive that might REQUIRE the skill we are making them perform for us. I have begun asking Peter's students, "Can you think of a situation where you might need to do this during a dive?" to get their brains working and really engaged in the exercise, instead of performing it by rote.

The young man we dove with yesterday was, at the end of his first dive, cold and uncomfortable, and you could see the look on his face when Peter told him he had to take his gear and weight belt off and put them back on. The look said, louder than words, that he thought the exercise was stupid harassment, when all he wanted was to get out of the water. When I explained to him that we take our gear off in the water to get back on our boat, his expression changed. He was still uncomfortable, but at least now he knew why we were making him do this ridiculous thing.

Lynne,
I do this as part of the briefing before teaching the skill in the pool, "in the unlikely event" or sometimes...

 

[dumpsterDiver]

Well, the T-rod stringer weighs maybe a pound, and the fish are neutral, so it's not much of an "anchor". But I have had sharks swim up behind me and snatch my stringer out of my hand, and I have always been glad those fish weren't tied to me.

There are often way too many sharks to use a stringer where I was diving. I was throwing them into a mesh bag, which is a little better around sharks. When they are really bad, you have to send the fish to the surface on an smb and hope the sharks don't chase it to the surface (which happens some times).

 

[flots am]

I don't recommend this, but I'll throw it out there.
If faced with going out of air because of free flow you can actually bend the hose in half and stop the flow, while breathing from your alternate.
Better to replace a hose than go OOA or risk an embolism.

Kinking the second stage hose might temporarily stop a second stage freeflow caused by lack of maintenance, however if you do it to a freeflow caused by ice in the first stage, all it will get you is a damaged hose and a freeflowing alternate second stage. And you'll have tied up a hand for nothing and accomplished nothing except waste time, since you still need to surface.

Or you could just breathe from the freeflow (it breathes just fine) and end the dive. Or share air with your buddy and end the dive. Or do an OOA ascent (works just fine from recreational depths) and end the dive. In any case, there is no additional risk of an embolism from breathing a freeflow. It's just bubbles and they're all at ambient pressure.

And this is exactly the kind of thing I'm talking about. Instead of a simple, reliable procedure, they now have an additional, useless procedure to consider, even though it can't fix anything, but will waste time and air.

I just don't understand why people are in such a hurry to complicate something that should be simple.

flots.

 

[knowone]

If you swap to your alternate first, reducing pressure on the whole setup and have a fiddle with your primary or the hose and show some dive, gear competence in attempting to solve a problem under there, thus not having to resort to the oft prescribed escape solution then that is good.

If it works continue the dive.

If after a few more precious seconds, tick tick tick seconds and it doesn't, abort.

Because there is no such thing as simply ending a dive whether by yourself or especially with certain others.

Because it is simply not the nature of the beast unless it is a particularly well practiced beast.

But this is only one of many options to endless scenarios.

 

[flots am]

If you swap to your alternate first, reducing pressure on the whole setup and have a fiddle with your primary or the hose and show some dive, gear competence in attempting to solve a problem under there, thus not having to resort to the oft prescribed escape solution then that is good.

"Swapping to your alternate" doesn't reduce pressure on anything.

If it works continue the dive. If after a few more precious seconds, tick tick tick seconds and it doesn't, abort.

There are no conditions when kinking a hose fixes anything. If you had ice buildup in the first stage, you still have it. If you had a second stage that needs maintenance, it still needs it.

Because there is no such thing as simply ending a dive whether by yourself or especially with certain others.

If you can't safely end the dive at any time, you're not doing an Open Water Recreational Dive, and are diving outside the conditions of the training an OW diver has received.

flots.

 

[synctek]

This free flow discussion is interesting - never had one flow while I was breathing from it but the coldest water I've been in was 48F and only for about 30 minutes. I remember the OW course explaining free flow and how to tilt and breath off of it but to this day I am not sure why I would need to take a reg out I could still breath from it. It seems to me that if its free flowing while in your mouth, then you head up.

Now here's a question for the experienced divers....lets say you were sitting at 800lbs and 60ft just ending your dive. on your way up, the reg begins to free-flow - if you can't get it to stop, would you have enough air to ascend for a full minute or would you end up ooa at some point doing a CESA?

 

[danvolker]

This free flow discussion is interesting - never had one flow while I was breathing from it but the coldest water I've been in was 48F and only for about 30 minutes. I remember the OW course explaining free flow and how to tilt and breath off of it but to this day I am not sure why I would need to take a reg out I could still breath from it. It seems to me that if its free flowing while in your mouth, then you head up.

Now here's a question for the experienced divers....lets say you were sitting at 800lbs and 60ft just ending your dive. on your way up, the reg begins to free-flow - if you can't get it to stop, would you have enough air to ascend for a full minute or would you end up ooa at some point doing a CESA?

First, my buddy would be right next to me, so there would be essentially no issue and no concerns. I would have his or her long hose a moment after the free flow began, and the two of us would easily do a normal ascent with the stops we would normally do prior to surfacing.
If I was without a buddy, because Jaws just ate him, or because I became retarded on the dive to the degree that I lost my buddy, then I would just continue up at around a 60 ft per minute ascent, and breathe through the reg until it quit....Good chance it could make it to the surface though, so I would be inclined to breathe it while possible....and of course, it is easy to do a cesa from 60 feet as well--but this is the last choice.

Regards,

DanV