What really is an "Advanced Open Water" diver?

[Lorenzoid]

Check out these exclusions from an Allianz travel policy:

This section describes the general exclusions applicable to all coverages under your policy. An “exclusion” is
something that is not covered by this insurance policy, and therefore no reimbursement would be available.
This policy does not provide coverage for any loss that results directly or indirectly from any of the following
general exclusions if they affect you, a traveling companion, or a family member:
1. Any loss, condition, or event that was known, foreseeable, intended, or expected when your policy was
purchased;
2. Pre-Existing medical conditions, except as waived under the Pre-Existing Medical Condition Exclusion Waiver;
3. Your intentional self-harm or if you attempt or commit suicide;
4. Normal pregnancy or childbirth, except as expressly covered under Trip Cancellation Coverage;
5. Fertility treatments or elective abortion;
6. A mental or nervous health disorder, as recognized by the American Psychiatric Association, including but not
limited to Alzheimer’s disease, anxiety, dementia, depression, neurosis, psychosis, or any related physical
symptoms. This exclusion applies only to Trip Cancellation Coverage and Trip Interruption Coverage;
7. The use or abuse of alcohol or drugs, or any related physical symptoms. This does not apply to drugs
prescribed by a doctor and used as prescribed;
8. Acts committed with the intent to cause loss;
9. Operating or working as a crew member (including as a trainee or learner/student) aboard any aircraft or
commercial vehicle or commercial watercraft;
10. Participating in or training for any professional sporting competition;
11. Participating in or training for any amateur sporting competition while on your trip;
12. Participating in extreme, high-risk sports and activities, including but not limited to:
a. Skydiving, BASE jumping, hang gliding, or parachuting;
b. Bungee jumping;
c. Caving, rappelling, or spelunking;
d. Skiing or snowboarding outside marked trails or in an area accessed by helicopter;
e. Climbing sports or free climbing;
f. Any high-altitude activity;
g. Personal combat or fighting sports;
h. Racing or practicing to race any motorized vehicle or watercraft;
i. Free diving; or
j. Scuba diving at a depth greater than 60 feet or without a dive master.

 

[AdivingBel]

Man I hate to see this as Allianz is a player. Probably won't be long before this proliferates as somebody in the industry has run some numbers $$. Fortunately DAN covers me in my part of the world as long as I'm more than 50 miles from home, but still...

 

[boulderjohn]

I was recently looking at travel/medical policies, and at least one that I recall excluded coverage for scuba diving deeper than 60 feet. It also said something about the presence of an instructor--maybe it was deeper than 60 feet without an instructor present. In any case, it caught my attention. I don't care about that aspect of the policy because I have DAN insurance. But people really do need to read the fine print.

I certified a longtime friend of mine some years ago, but I could not do it until he retired. As a small business owner, the business was dependent upon him and his personal education and training. He therefore had to have a good life insurance policy, and that policy excluded diving to any depth. Once he retired, he dropped the policy, and is now an active scuba diver.

 

[boulderjohn]

The point of PADI is it's recreational diving and thus has to be planned within the RDP to 40m/130' (8 minutes bottom time). No gas planning required -- unless you're using Nitrox and they've got a course for that.

PADI actually does some gas planning early on, although not as much as I would like. There is even a question on planning a dive using the rule of thirds on the OW final exam--at least the book version of the course.

 

[Wibble]

Check out these exclusions from an Allianz travel policy:
...
j. Scuba diving at a depth greater than 60 feet or without a dive master.

Without a DiveMASTER - wot bollox is that! At least they don't exclude solo diving or cave/mine diving with a DPV 2 miles into the cenote.

Plain to see that Allianz doesn't cover anything interesting.

 

[scubadada]

I took PADI OW in 1997, AOW in 2004, and Rescue in 2005. I don't remember any significant teaching regarding gas use or planning. I picked up SAC/RMV and gas planning myself. By the time I did SDI Solo in 2013, I had my RMV for more than the last 300 dives.

 

[Wibble]

I took PADI OW in 1997, AOW in 2004, and Rescue in 2005. I don't remember any significant teaching regarding gas use or planning. I picked up SAC/RMV and gas planning myself. By the time I did SDI Solo in 2013, I had my RMV for more than the last 300 dives.

Current OW/AOW instructors... Gas planning...
Does the current course material mention RMV or SAC for rough 'air' consumption calculations? Any rules of thumb regarding minimum gas pressure?

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

Wish min gas was taught universally in open water. People try to maximize bottom time and come up with 500 psi. Would rather see recreational divers ascend a little each time they hit min gas to get a new lower min gas at the shallower depth. I understand that this is not always possible.

 

[boulderjohn]

I took PADI OW in 1997, AOW in 2004, and Rescue in 2005. I don't remember any significant teaching regarding gas use or planning. I picked up SAC/RMV and gas planning myself. By the time I did SDI Solo in 2013, I had my RMV for more than the last 300 dives.

I wrote a distinctive specialty in advanced dive planning around 2013--can't remember exactly when. It took a long time to get it all approved. My course included gas planning--quite a bit. One aspect of it was rule of thirds, and they quibbled over that, saying that was more for technical diving. I responded by describing its uses in knowing when to turn a dive in certain OW situations, and they approved it. A couple years later, the new OW curriculum came out, and it included finding the turning point for a dive using the rule of thirds.

 

[Altamira]

j. Scuba diving at a depth greater than 60 feet or without a dive master.

This exclusion used to be in the fine print of DAN's travel insurance policy, but I can't remember what insurance company was the underwriter at that time. When I saw that little caveat, I wrote DAN's CEO a WTH letter, pointing out the ridiculous nature of a policy marketed toward divers that had an exclusion like that. Unfortunately, I did not receive a reply, so I stopped using DAN for travel insurance, and never checked back to see if they changed the exclusion. Perhaps it is still in their policy.