Weight system for BP wing ...

[Dr. Lecter]

I'm not sure which part of this you're missing. Let's say I'm +20lb at the surface in my drysuit; I'm diving a set of steel double 130s with an AL plate and a stage slung AL80, and we'll say I need an extra 5lb on a belt or on the rig to be neutral at my 10' stop with 500psi in all my tanks.

Floating all that as a combined mass at the surface with full tanks needs a smaller wing than the wing needed for floating just the rig with full tanks at the surface...because then the rig is not being aided by my buoyancy. Tobin's point, which I'm not sure is that relevant depending on the OP's setup, is that any weight on the diver need not be accounted for in the negativity of the rig itself.

Shorter answer: the "entire setup" is probably less negatively buoyant than the rig by itself with no diver in it.

 

[uncfnp]

Does this hold enough weight for you.

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/cl...tems/463823-2-dive-rite-16-lb-wt-pockets.html

 

[GrumpyOldGuy]

Look at the DUI classic harness if you dive cold water.
It is more complex than a weight belt, but allows you to adjust your trim and eliminates issues with a belt sliding down you butt.
It uses a zip type release that is very reliable and you can do partial dumps.
You also don't have to worry about belt under or over crotch strap, its a non-issue.

 

[CAPTAIN SINBAD]

+1 with Tobin (cool_hardware52)

I like this:

XS Scuba Adjustable Weight Belt discounts on sale XS Scuba

When I goof my weight I can use a rock for more or leave 1 pocket's worth by the anchor line.

That is the one I use presently. Do you wear it under the crotch strap or over it?

 

[Rooster59]

I put it on first, so it's under the crotch strap. Why? A Navy diver told me to, so that's the way I do it.

 

[cool_hardware52]

Halcyon made a few versions of these in their "Active Ballast Control system": the early ones used horizontally-inserted pockets and retainers that attached to the BP using a bolt; the next variant used the same pockets but had a triglide attachment ; the newest flavor I'm aware of uses the triglide attachment but has gone to a vertical-inserted pocket...which is good, as the pocket is less likely to fall out and dangle by its clip while in horizontal trim, but will drop clean when in a vertical position (i.e., emergency). Like all things H, it is stupidly overpriced but very nice.

Diverite seems to make some stuff along the same lines that's cheaper: BC Accessory Pockets by Dive Rite - Dive Gear Express



Says the guy who has bolt-on weight plates for his BPs? Which isn't to say I don't like that approach myself... but at least this remains ditch-able. And if he really needs the rig to float itself without him in it, he can ditch the weight and not need a huge wing.

It appears you don't understand the concepts I advocate. Our bolt on weight plates are useful for diving that require a lot of ballast, but I do not recommend divers in temperate to cold water have 100% of their ballast on their rig.

If a diver mounts 100% of their ballast to their rig, ditichable or not, their wing will have to float *all* of their ballast + all of their gas. If OTOH the diver carries ballast at least equal to the weight of their gas on their person, i.e. in a belt or weight harness, then the diver can potentially use a smaller wing. Minimum wing capacity is the larger of 1) the Buoyancy of the divers exposure suit, 2) The maximum negative value of the divers rig including a full cylinder.

Doing so allows minimum wing sizing *without* requiring the diver ditch drop anything in event they need to ditch their rig, or put their gear on in the water.

Those that have purchased DSS gear are well aware that I routinely recommend *not* using our weight plates if that means the diver will have no ballast on their person.

Tobin

 

[Peter Guy]

OP -- ignoring all the back and forth which has nothing to do with your question, can you please explain why you want to put all your weight (ballast) on your BP?

I hate weight belts and refuse to use them but I also didn't want to put all of my weight on my BP for the reasons stated above -- it just makes the thing too darn heavy! As I dive in cold water/dry suit, I need/want about 30 pounds of ballast to stay WARM and down.

I have a DSS plate and use the bolt on plates -- that's 14 pounds of negativity.

The other 16 pounds is in a DUI weight and trim harness which, as explained, allows me to dump the weight if I want to (note -- this is theoretical only -- I'll confess I haven't pulled the pockets in 5 or 6 years!). IF I need to get into a small boat (not a theoretical issue) I can easily ditch the BP and then hand up the harness all by itself or just not worry about the additional 16 pounds -- as opposed to the total overall weight of the BP/Tank/Reg/Can Light which is close to 70-80 pounds.

 

[CAPTAIN SINBAD]

OP -- ignoring all the back and forth which has nothing to do with your question, can you please explain why you want to put all your weight (ballast) on your BP?

I hate weight belts and refuse to use them but I also didn't want to put all of my weight on my BP for the reasons stated above -- it just makes the thing too darn heavy! As I dive in cold water/dry suit, I need/want about 30 pounds of ballast to stay WARM and down.

I have a DSS plate and use the bolt on plates -- that's 14 pounds of negativity.

The other 16 pounds is in a DUI weight and trim harness which, as explained, allows me to dump the weight if I want to (note -- this is theoretical only -- I'll confess I haven't pulled the pockets in 5 or 6 years!). IF I need to get into a small boat (not a theoretical issue) I can easily ditch the BP and then hand up the harness all by itself or just not worry about the additional 16 pounds -- as opposed to the total overall weight of the BP/Tank/Reg/Can Light which is close to 70-80 pounds.

Yes. I tried different configurations and was still wondering which one would be the best. Here is a list of my experiences with each:

1. Weights pockets attached into BP-harness / webbing: They were easy to get into but had the tendency to slide down the webbing and rest right where the buckle was. I was using XS scuba weight pockets. Xs-Scuba Quick-Attach Single Weight Pocket | LeisurePro

Furthermore they also required the Wing to be bigger.

The biggest problem with them was when you are diving from a small six-pack boat that does not have a ladder to climb into. These boats require the weight belt to be handed to the boat crew (first) and then you unstrap your rig and that is handed to the crew (second). Finally the diver pulls himself into the boat while wearing only fins. With a weight integrated rig and steel tanks, it is way too much weight for the boat crew to be pulling out from the ocean into the boat all at once. It was this that caused me to look towards weight belts , the problems of which are as follows:

Belts: They are a major PIA if you want to put them on AFTER getting into the Rig. The only way I could use them was to wear then first and then settle into the rig. This caused the belt to be inside the crotch strap. While people are still debating whether this is a good idea for drysuit diving, for my kind of diving it presents other issues. Since I dive out of a six pack that does not have a climbing ladder, when I am attempting to get back into the boat the procedure is to hand the weight belt first. Now weight belt is tied under the crotch strap so that is not possible. It requires undoing the whole rig and then pulling the belt and handing that.

Ditchable pockets: I have never used them but found them to be the most practical. Instead of handing over the belt, divers diving with these would detach them and hand them to the crew while they are floating at the surface. Once all the weight has been handed they will then hand the Bp-wing rig and then climb back. Never used this before so I dont know first hand. Seemed simpler than the first two.

 

[cool_hardware52]

Belts: They are a major PIA if you want to put them on AFTER getting into the Rig. The only way I could use them was to wear then first and then settle into the rig. This caused the belt to be inside the crotch strap. While people are still debating whether this is a good idea for drysuit diving, for my kind of diving it presents other issues. Since I dive out of a six pack that does not have a climbing ladder, when I am attempting to get back into the boat the procedure is to hand the weight belt first. Now weight belt is tied under the crotch strap so that is not possible. It requires undoing the whole rig and then pulling the belt and handing that.

Simple fix if you want the weight belt *over* the harness and crotch strap;

Put the weight belt on first, just snug enough to keep it in place.

Put on your BP&W.

Reach behind you and find the plate end of the crotch strap. Pull it around to the side, *not* between your legs.

Stuff the end of the crotch strap down in between the weight belt and you, (from the top down)

Pull the the crotch strap down around to the back. Now the weight belt is *over* the crotch strap at the back.

Tuck the weight belt up in between the weight belt and the waist strap at the front and bingo the weight is entirely on top of the waist strap.

Snug up the weight belt.

Tobin

 

[CAPTAIN SINBAD]

Simple fix if you want the weight belt *over* the harness and crotch strap;

Put the weight belt on first, just snug enough to keep it in place.

Put on your BP&W.

Reach behind you and find the plate end of the crotch strap. Pull it around to the side, *not* between your legs.

Stuff the end of the crotch strap down in between the weight belt and you, (from the top down)

Pull the the crotch strap down around to the back. Now the weight belt is *over* the crotch strap at the back.

Tuck the weight belt up in between the weight belt and the waist strap at the front and bingo the weight is entirely on top of the waist strap.

Snug up the weight belt.

Tobin

Yes. I have been wanting to try this.