Warped View of the Dive World

[MauiScubaSteve]

I don't understand the point of this thread at all.

The point of this thread is to try to see what a realistic view of the dive World might be.

The point is to share our different views in this thread, to get a feeling for the different views by region, by experience level, by skill, by terrain, by personal preference....

By any measure you are interested in sharing.

Then take a look at Scubaboard's main forums, the forums where the whole World interacts. If the VAST MAJORITY of members could keep the local bias in the local forums, the main forums might attract more participation and actually be the fun that NetDoc tells his Mod's Scubaboard should be.

I think there are more than 200 working dive instructors living on Maui; all with computers and internet connections. Only 2 really participate on Scubaboard; less than 1%. I think there are likely a similar number of just divers from Maui and a similar percentage of Scubaboard participants; less than 1%.

That is my view of the Scubaboard dive World; Less than 1%.

 

[cooperscuba]

I'd disagree about open heel fins being less prevalent than FFF. If there's 10 divers on a boat here then maybe, and only maybe, 1, maybe 2, have FFF.

Also, we have approx. 90 cylinders in the center and one of those is a steel one, and that's fairly true for the majority of the centers here.

 

[bowlofpetunias]

I don't know what you consider warm water diving. I think that is relative. Compared to Canada and the Puget Sound we have warm water diving. Compared to New Guinea we have cold water diving.

Our winter diving temps drop into the 15C(59F) up to summer temps around 20C(68F).

It seems to me that Most divers consider whatever kind of diving they do to require the most skill and dedication. Too many consider the diving that is done in their corner of the world is the "norm".

I can tell you that there are a massive number of divers in Australia and they aren't all doing the GBR! A huge number of divers here do shore dives. I wouldn't be surprised if some of these sites have several hundred divers in a 24 hr period. I sat at one site.. not even one of the most popular and watched 38 divers enter the water in less than 30 minutes! Many of the longer term local divers rarely do boat dives here. They save their money so they can do more shore dives or trips away. There is no way you can keep track of the number of shore dives done in a year!
Most people need dive boots and therefor open heel fins because they are crossing baracle covered rock to get to the entries!

It is my perception that many "speciality divers" (tech, wreck, cave, CCR, DIR, Gue, photographers etc) consider divers who do not take courses beyond OW and AOW to lack the necessary skills to be competent and safe divers.


Sometimes IMHO we seem more interested in arguing about perceive differences, chest thumping and one-up-manship than sharing our common love of Scuba.

 

[lv2dive]

I wanted to respond before I read through what everyone else had to say, so maybe this has already been said... if so, I apologize. I've been lurking around SB for some time, registered quite a while after I started lurking, but I don't think I've posted a long reply to anything yet. This thread caught my interest because my personal perspective has evolved so much over my diving career. For the 14 months, I've been what I would would consider an "active" recreational diver (averaging ten dives a month), vs the first nine years, when I would consider myself a "vacation" recreational diver (averaging ten dives a year). So I've got two very different experiences and perspectives. And I think that is part of a disconnect - the "active" vs "vacation" rec diver are two very different flavors! I know for myself, as a vacation recreational diver, it was very much follow-the-leader, take advice from DMs, warm-water diving. As an active recreational diver I'm much more open because I want as many opportunities as possible. Below, I've spoken to my perception of the vast majority (which I see as vacation recreational divers), unless otherwise noted, my experience as a vacation recreational diver was consistent with what I indicated for the vast majority. In a lot of cases, it's been different as an "active" rec diver, as discussed below. Anyways, hope this makes sense:


I think the VAST MAJORITY of "recreational" dives made in the World are made in waters 70 degrees F and warmer.
Vast majority: Agreed. Me as active rec diver: Not necessarily

I think the VAST MAJORITY of "recreational" dives made in the World are made with Aluminum 80 cubic foot-ish tanks.
Vast majority: Agreed. Me as active rec diver: Agreed, mostly (when renting tanks), but purchased tanks are steel

I think the VAST MAJORITY of "recreational" dives made in the World are made using Vest BC's.
Vast majority: Agreed. Me as active rec diver: No (switched to BP/W in April and haven't looked back. Do have a Zuma for travel, which is great, I usually bring with me as an backup but I've only worn it once since the trip I bought it)

I think the VAST MAJORITY of "recreational" dives in the World are made wearing 5 mm or less wet suits.
Vast majority: Agreed. Me as active rec diver: Not necessarily (bought the drysuit so I could dive the colder water)

I think the VAST MAJORITY of "recreational divers" first OW courses were "booked" as 3 or 4 day classes.
Vast majority: Agreed. (my experience as well, sad to say. I know better now)

I think it is highly likely the VAST MAJORITY of "recreational" dives made in the World are made using full foot fins.
Can't say I agree with this one.

I think it is highly likely the VAST MAJORITY of "recreational" dives made in the World are "guided dives."
Vast majority: Agreed. Me in present/future: Hell No
The first nine years of diving that was all I knew. The first time I dove NC and was told us if we wanted a guide we'd have to pay for a DM, I handed over the $ so fast it wasn't funny, because it had never crossed my mind I'd dive without guide. Once I got my mind around the idea that I didn't *have* to have a guide, I started diving without one (in FL, etc,) but it wasn't until I stopped what I call the "vacation" recreation diving and started getting serious about diving that I got comfortable diving without a guide. Now I'm not comfortable with anyone touching my gear and I would balk if I was with an operation that insisted on guiding.

I think it is highly likely the VAST MAJORITY of "recreational divers" will go "deep" within their first dozen logged dives. (>100')
Can't say I agree with this one

I think it is highly likely the VAST MAJORITY of "recreational divers" will go "under rock" within their first dozen logged dives. (Cavern, not arch)
Can't say I agree with this one.

I agree at least the last two may be a function of living in Hawaii :

Thanks for the thought-provoking post.

 

[Kern]

I'd disagree about open heel fins being less prevalent than FFF. If there's 10 divers on a boat here then maybe, and only maybe, 1, maybe 2, have FFF.

Also, we have approx. 90 cylinders in the center and one of those is a steel one, and that's fairly true for the majority of the centers here.

Could you tell us the working pressure, & water capacity of the aluminium tanks?

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

It seems to me that Most divers consider whatever kind of diving they do to require the most skill and dedication. Too many consider the diving that is done in their corner of the world is the "norm".

I think this is usually the source of the conflicts that come up here so often. People tend to view the way they do things as "normal" and judge how others do things accordingly.

Truth is, how we dive ... how we even think about diving ... is very much dictated by the environment we dive in.

I can tell you that there are a massive number of divers in Australia and they aren't all doing the GBR! A huge number of divers here do shore dives. I wouldn't be surprised if some of these sites have several hundred divers in a 24 hr period. I sat at one site.. not even one of the most popular and watched 38 divers enter the water in less than 30 minutes! Many of the longer term local divers rarely do boat dives here. They save their money so they can do more shore dives or trips away. There is no way you can keep track of the number of shore dives done in a year!
Most people need dive boots and therefor open heel fins because they are crossing baracle covered rock to get to the entries!

That generally describes where I live too. The "normal" diver here dives in a drysuit, dives steel tanks, and dives year-round. Doing more than 100 dives in a year here isn't a milestone ... it's fairly "normal" ... because shore diving's common, and you can dive here all year. That doesn't make our divers "fringe" ... it just makes us typical for our environment.

It is my perception that many "speciality divers" (tech, wreck, cave, CCR, DIR, Gue, photographers etc) consider divers who do not take courses beyond OW and AOW to lack the necessary skills to be competent and safe divers.

I think a person's attitude contributes more to their competence and safety than how long they've been diving or how many classes they've taken.

Sometimes IMHO we seem more interested in arguing about perceive differences, chest thumping and one-up-manship than sharing our common love of Scuba.

But that's true in every recreational activity I've ever been involved in. There are always those who get into it more than others ... and ego is often the motivating factor behind those who put a lot of effort into performing at a high level. What you're describing, I think, boils down more to our differences as humans than our differences as divers ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I am relatively sure there are many warm water "dive destinations" with more than 50,000 divers per year, making more than 100,000 dives per year. Restricting "warm warter" to just a little outside the Tropics, I think the South Pacific might be home to the most annual "warm water" dives all by itself. And I think rental gear makes most of the dives; including fins!

But here's a perfect example of the fallacy of your thinking ... you cannot just classify divers by water temperature.

I'd be willing to bet that Bonaire ... tiny as it is ... hosts more divers per year than Maui. Pretty much anybody who goes to Bonaire is going there for the diving ... and most will be planning more than 2 dives per day. And I think you'd be hard-pressed to find full-foot fins in Bonaire. Walking over the hard-pan entries would be pretty hard without booties after all ... and the vast majority of people who dive there aren't going out on boats for every dive.

I saw very few full-foot fins in Indonesia ... that would encompass several dive locations in Bali, Komodo and north Sulawesi. Can't speak for the other 2700+ islands, but most of the divers I saw there were wearing booties ... and therefore open-heel fins ... even on dive boats.

Same goes for Cozumel, Roatan and Belize ... those wearing full-foot fins were a tiny minority.

Full-foot fins only work if you're diving off of nice, sand beaches or off of a boat ... even in warm water.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

The point of this thread is to try to see what a realistic view of the dive World might be.

The point is to share our different views in this thread, to get a feeling for the different views by region, by experience level, by skill, by terrain, by personal preference....

By any measure you are interested in sharing.

Then take a look at Scubaboard's main forums, the forums where the whole World interacts. If the VAST MAJORITY of members could keep the local bias in the local forums, the main forums might attract more participation and actually be the fun that NetDoc tells his Mod's Scubaboard should be.

I think there are more than 200 working dive instructors living on Maui; all with computers and internet connections. Only 2 really participate on Scubaboard; less than 1%. I think there are likely a similar number of just divers from Maui and a similar percentage of Scubaboard participants; less than 1%.

That is my view of the Scubaboard dive World; Less than 1%.

I'll agree with your conclusions, but not your logic. The "VAST MAJORITY" diver you're defining won't come to ScubaBoard no matter what we do ... because internet forums tend to attract enthusiasts, and the "VAST MAJORITY" diver you're describing isn't an enthusiast of scuba diving ... to them it's a casual activity that they might give thought to once or twice a year ... if that.

If we did as you descibe, and the enthusiasts on ScubaBoard restricted themselves to only local forums (a very weird suggestion, to my concern), then the "major" forums would drop off to the point where you'd have only a handful of casual participants ... and eventually would die from lack of participation.

ScubaBoard certainly doesn't conform to your view of the "VAST MAJORITY" diver ... I see no reason why it should. Like every other business, it's going to cater to the majority of those who would want to "buy" what they're selling ... and that ain't the diver you're describing ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Insta-Gator]

Average? Normal? Is this to be derived by the practice of all divers, equally weighted, or by dives made? I suspect the majority of dives made are performed by a minority of divers (rec/tech vs vacation.) Unfortunately, I fall into the 10 dives per year vacation category. Now that I'm retired I'm working on improving my education and locating local sites to improve my skill. As time and money allow I will visit salt water somewhere. Location/Time/Finances dictate, for many, their "diving category" and thus their derived/practiced skill. I appreciate the advice of more experienced divers, but don't get in my face or start spouting off like it's some type of religious experience.

 

[TMHeimer]

The point of this thread is to try to see what a realistic view of the dive World might be.

The point is to share our different views in this thread, to get a feeling for the different views by region, by experience level, by skill, by terrain, by personal preference....

By any measure you are interested in sharing.

Then take a look at Scubaboard's main forums, the forums where the whole World interacts. If the VAST MAJORITY of members could keep the local bias in the local forums, the main forums might attract more participation and actually be the fun that NetDoc tells his Mod's Scubaboard should be.

I think there are more than 200 working dive instructors living on Maui; all with computers and internet connections. Only 2 really participate on Scubaboard; less than 1%. I think there are likely a similar number of just divers from Maui and a similar percentage of Scubaboard participants; less than 1%.

That is my view of the Scubaboard dive World; Less than 1%.

Once again, I agree with all of this. I'm not sure what you're pointing out regarding the % of Scubaboard participants from Maui though. We have 12 instructors and 10 DMs at our LDS, and probably a huge % of divers from the entire province (since we are basically the only real LDS in Nova Scotia). I have yet to meet anyone at all here who has even heard of scubaboard.